AoS turned the corner...?

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Axis Mundi
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AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Axis Mundi » Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:14 am

So the financials are out, and apart from it looking like GW have finally arrested the decline (sales down very slightly, but bad Christmas seems to be the culprit), they also take the time to highlight this - "we finished the year with sales of Warhammer: Age of Sigmar at a higher rate than Warhammer has enjoyed for several years."

It looks like the AoS push this year has worked?

Here is the link - for once it's not too depressing a read!

http://investor.games-workshop.com/

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Scoutbike » Tue Jul 26, 2016 1:17 pm

Yeah AoS is good.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby marjedi » Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:25 pm

Maybe this can finally shut up the angry naysayers.

AoS is a big hit, and is here to stay.

And no, it is not sales for people playing 9th age.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Nibbles » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:59 pm

I'd say that AoS could be seen as a big hit indeed if its sales eclipsed those of the 8th edition during the equivalent span of time. We're just starting to arrive into the second year of the game now, 8th had its initial success and then declined, AoS had a terrible launch and has been slowly trending up from that. How high will it rise until the eventual decline comes and will that be enough to prevent it from being a flop when compared to 8th?

The game itself might not be driving the sales as much as the past editions of Warhammer did, the new models might have more to do with that. 9th age is not the only competing game system either which is driving up the sales of GW models, all these alternatives do pile up and have a positive effect on GW sales, alternatives which did NOT have such a high player base before AoS came along.

I think we really ought to compare the numbers, how much had 8th sold in a similar time period after its launch? Someone here probably has that data as well, I know I don't but would be interested in seeing it. If the game were selling better than 8th ever did, that would be wonderful indeed as it would indicate that a new healthier customer base has been successfully created and GW would likely continue making fantasy Warhammer instead of trashing it entirely in a couple of years.
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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Axis Mundi » Wed Jul 27, 2016 11:05 am

It's no surprise that the improvement post Christmas coincided with the Start Collecting sets and the arrival of the £20 battletomes. I expect the Ironjaws helped as well - and these figures don't even include the Sylvaneth or the Handbook.

The product line up has improved hugely this year, and GWs direction of travel is far clearer - this looks set to continue. As a player I'm just very relieved that GW aren't going to hit the panic button, and should now keep supporting the game.

Btw, my recall of the 8th launch was that it was quite dreadful, with little to no product from GW for months and months. I've always thought that it never really recovered from that - hence the carpet bombing of AoS books and models this year, to avoid a similar fate. Just a shame they did it back to front (should have started with the Handbook - ah, hindsight...).

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Nibbles » Thu Jul 28, 2016 10:21 am

Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.

We'd really need to compare those sales figures to see how things actually are.
I do respect your opinions even when I do not state so, we are all free to disagree and agree here. And I certainly do not assume that my ideas about the rules would be the only proper ones. We all have our own ways for playing these games and that is fine.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Payce » Thu Jul 28, 2016 1:35 pm

Nibbles wrote:Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.


You're really answering your own premise here. 8th had these things during the first few months after launch. The hype for 8th edition fell off fairly quickly afterwards, with a string of sub-par releases (TK, O&G hardbacks) and a general relapse into the mentality that "I already have everything I need for this game". People was excited for the rules, but they didn't start new armies.

AoS was the polar opposite. The "hate train" was absolutely immeasurable because of people not wanting to accept the change (even if it was brought on themselves, by people "having everything they need for this game" and not supporting it financially). As the months passed and the "hate train" derailed, because people actually started to play and enjoy the game, people started new armies. In my gaming area, everyone except one has started new armies exclusively for AoS after first playing it with their existing armies. At a lot of gaming communities, the AoS crowd is now eclipsing 40k, because the game is simply less convoluted and far more enjoyable as a casual game, even with the added competitive edge of clash/SCGT/General's.

But I'm more than happy to have this talk again in three years with you. Because I'm fully convinced I'll be seeing the same amazing community and interest for AoS then as I do now, so long as GW keeps developing this product as well as they have for the first year.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Sleboda » Thu Jul 28, 2016 2:47 pm

Axis Mundi wrote: Just a shame they did it back to front (should have started with the Handbook - ah, hindsight...).


I actually believe doing it this way was brilliant. It shook things up, jettisoned the Warhammer equivalent of Beardy Historical Gamers, taught many of those who remained that there is fun without The One True Way of Points, and so on.

Adding the GH later was the better approach, I believe.
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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby amysrevenge » Thu Jul 28, 2016 5:44 pm

Nibbles wrote:Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.

We'd really need to compare those sales figures to see how things actually are.


Are we remembering the same 8th ed launch? The mass ragequits? Not anything near the level of AoS ragequits, to be certain, but it was shocking at the time.
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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby tranc » Fri Jul 29, 2016 3:45 am

marjedi wrote:Maybe this can finally shut up the angry naysayers.

AoS is a big hit, and is here to stay.

And no, it is not sales for people playing 9th age.

I had to create a forum account to answer this post :lol:

I have recently purchased 4 start collecting boxes. Not one of them was motivated by any desire to play AoS.

Rather, I bought them because
1) the prices (with ~20% internet store discount) have not been this close to reasonable in years, and
2) I wanted to pick up some cool traditional fantasy aesthetic miniatures for my square-based army before they go out of stock/style for good.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby WoodenGoblin » Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:26 am

There's a 20% discount code floating around? :(

I just dropped about $300 at a local (chain) hobby store and $1800 at GW's website.

I bought a 1000 Point Moonclan Army, a 2000 Bonesplitterz Army, a 2500 Ironjawz army, the Greenskinz Start Collecting box to practice on, and a lot of books to enjoy some fluff.

Saving $400+ would have been nice. :(

I can't wait to get painting though! Should be good for this winter.
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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby lil tim » Fri Jul 29, 2016 8:31 am

I think what he means is that he bought from an online retailer that typically does 20% off GW RRP for new releases, like Element Games in the UK.
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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby jouso » Fri Jul 29, 2016 9:45 am

amysrevenge wrote:
Nibbles wrote:Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.

We'd really need to compare those sales figures to see how things actually are.


Are we remembering the same 8th ed launch? The mass ragequits? Not anything near the level of AoS ragequits, to be certain, but it was shocking at the time.


I got a 90% beautifully painted HE army for something like 1/10 of its retail cost at the beginning of 8th. At that time it seemed like the end times were coming :mrgreen:

And it still continues to this day. There are still a few very vocal 6th/7th fans with a myriad fan rulesets still blaming everything on 8th edition.

Nice to see AoS numbers going up, but those numbers will still be suspect until after the big clearout of Brets, TK and older WHFB kits effect is gone. Demand was so big they even did additional runs.... and I'm pretty sure 90% of those won't be used for AoS.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Nibbles » Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:24 pm

amysrevenge wrote:
Nibbles wrote:Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.

We'd really need to compare those sales figures to see how things actually are.


Are we remembering the same 8th ed launch? The mass ragequits? Not anything near the level of AoS ragequits, to be certain, but it was shocking at the time.


Yeah, the amount of positive buzz was greater and the amount of hate & quitters much lower. We are remembering the same launch, and it went much better for 8th than it did for AoS. Of course, 6th and 7th ed launches went even better, 8th was a far cry from the golden ages of Warhammer.

Payce wrote:
Nibbles wrote:Again, I don't have the sales figures, but 8th had a lot more positive buzz & players than AoS at launch and during the following months. There were a lot more events and the global community kept supporting it through the international tournaments as usual. I base my statement of it being more successful than AoS, on that.


You're really answering your own premise here. 8th had these things during the first few months after launch. The hype for 8th edition fell off fairly quickly afterwards, with a string of sub-par releases (TK, O&G hardbacks) and a general relapse into the mentality that "I already have everything I need for this game". People was excited for the rules, but they didn't start new armies.

AoS was the polar opposite. The "hate train" was absolutely immeasurable because of people not wanting to accept the change (even if it was brought on themselves, by people "having everything they need for this game" and not supporting it financially). As the months passed and the "hate train" derailed, because people actually started to play and enjoy the game, people started new armies. In my gaming area, everyone except one has started new armies exclusively for AoS after first playing it with their existing armies. At a lot of gaming communities, the AoS crowd is now eclipsing 40k, because the game is simply less convoluted and far more enjoyable as a casual game, even with the added competitive edge of clash/SCGT/General's.

But I'm more than happy to have this talk again in three years with you. Because I'm fully convinced I'll be seeing the same amazing community and interest for AoS then as I do now, so long as GW keeps developing this product as well as they have for the first year.


I don't think we'll have this talk again in three years... GW has never kept developing the editions at an even pace, support & improvements have been cut off after a while in order for the next edition to sell better. 8th even received downgrades in the form of some of the End Times expansions.

Likewise, the communities & interest have always dwindled away after a while. AoS will go through the same period of stagnation as all the Warhammer games before it. This is just part of all gaming hobbies, the ride only lasts so far.

8th did have several years of active events & tournaments btw, it was not mere months. People started plenty of new armies also, they just did not buy as much from GW as that had been made prohibitively expensive.

That error has been mostly fixed now though, AoS having a very low barrier of entry. Only time will tell, whether this means growth even when the support has already been cut off.
I do respect your opinions even when I do not state so, we are all free to disagree and agree here. And I certainly do not assume that my ideas about the rules would be the only proper ones. We all have our own ways for playing these games and that is fine.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby AoS-King » Sat Jul 30, 2016 1:54 pm

The point system is drawing in the huge chunk of competitive players who left. The game is really starting to become something amazing, especially with the format of the new battletomes. I am excited for the future.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby Cool Mint » Sun Jun 18, 2017 3:07 pm

I don't play (or paint, or read the books) so I'm not really sure what the big deal is about the change in the rules other than the game has been simplified/dumbed-down, but I am dissappointed by the look of AOS.

Age of Sigmar is fugly.

There, I said it.


I don't like the new models. Yes some of them are super-amazing, like the new Tzeentch demon, but maybe it's a bit too super amazing? Somehow it just doesn't look like Warhammer to me. It's the new human soldiers in particular I don't like; as some have already said, they look like cheap plastic army-men or something you'd find in the toys section. They just look like Space Marines. What happened to the Medieval style peasant soldiers of old?

From this:
Image

To this:
Image

It's better, but it's wrong. It's just so, so wrong.

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Re: AoS turned the corner...?

Postby zerocool » Thu Jun 22, 2017 5:31 pm

I really don't understand the urge of contradicting AOS with 9th.
If you are happy with your game/company that represents it then there really is no need to challenge rivals. If you indeed do keep contradicting while being happy with GW, then there are issues with your internal balance.
I personally don't care much about AOS turning pages or books or tomes or encyclopedias I just wish that GW stays alive so that it continues providing the world with awesome minis. Which we will take and field under good rules and balance. Be it 9th, sin6.7th, Σ8th or whatever : a strictly profit driven company will never ever produce balanced games especially with a heavily burdened past (hello Matt Ward Daemons/Gav Thorpe Dark Elves).
So every one is happy. I can't understand this need of challenge.
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