The ninth age

Platform for development and feedback of the ninth age project

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Lagge
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The ninth age

Postby Lagge » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:07 am

Official webpage



Hi folks!

With the coming of Sigmar, Games Workshop allows us to play with whatever rules we want. As a competitive gamer and warhammer enthusiast (been playing for 19 years), I want the ninth edition of the game, developed by people that actually know the game. TheNigthAge will bring you this!

The main idea is to cover all things from 8th edition and in the long run rework the armies. The first release will give you a new rulebook, most things will be kept the same, just rephrasing of rules to let people understand the rules more easily. The main focus will be to get a simple system that cant be misunderstood. Spells will be reworked, misscasts will be reworked (more punishing for using more dices and less punishing when using less dices).

In the long run all units will be worked, spearmens will be cheaper while warlocks will be more expensive as an example. All armies will get larger updates (brettonia and beastmen needs this the most). The statslines will be stay the same while the special rules and point costs of the models might change.

In the future there will be webpage with everything gathered, updated FAQs and such, everything free of charge. Rules will be released and updated every third month. The first realease will be just before ETC 2015.

All feedback will be appreciated and you will always reach us at TheNinthAge( a t]gmail.com

EDIT
Razon had a good point, who are we?
My name is Johan Lagmo and have been playing the game for 19 years. The last five years I have been playing for the swedish ETC team with 5 different races (including this year). I was one of the founders for the swedish comp system, but later fell off that wagon.
I am soon to be 27 years old and I have a masters in Biotechnology. For the last two years I have been working as a developing engineer fo a biotech company. I and two friends have a videocast called outside the box on youtube. check some videos of us and get an idea of our view of the game. there is also a longer introduction to who I am there. Then there will be one more person involved in this. It is the Kaj, another swedish ETC player and he can introduce himself :)

Sneak peek on what we are currently working on. Two documents:

The 9th Age RULES UPDATE sneak peek.pdf


This will include rules updates. Currently new rulse for magic phase and line of sight.


The 9th Age ARMY CONSTRUCTION sneak peek.pdf


This will include stuff that more directly influence army construction (new points costs, new magic items, updated lores etc). Currently this mostly includes examples in what types of changes we are planning (new points, new rules, restrictions on how many of a certain unit you may include, what counts as core and so on). Please consider these more as exmaples and ideas than finalized changes.

Tell us what you think about the changes. Both de new stuff, but also more generally; too much changes? to few changes? wrong types of changes? etc
Last edited by Lagge on Sat Jul 11, 2015 2:54 pm, edited 5 times in total.
ETC '11 Montreux, Switzerland: Team Sweden DoC player
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ETC '13 Novi Sad, Serbia: Team Sweden Skaven player
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Re: The ninth age

Postby Cyel » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:17 am

Note that it is very difficult to appease everyone, as people have different expectations. For example I loved 6th edition with it's focus on maneuver and static CR and I'd like to see WH that is 6th + limiting randomness (eg instead of dealing D6 Wounds you deal D3+2 or just a set amount really like always 4 ...or the totally random nature of break tests deciding fate of entire units) But many people think including more randomness in the game is a good move (gasp :shock: ) and like the cheerful dice rolling at every opportunity of the 8th
Last edited by Cyel on Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
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derm
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Re: The ninth age

Postby derm » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:19 am

Bravo. The community needs to look after itself now. =D>

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Razon » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:35 am

This sounds great! I'm sure you can produce a better game then GW has ever done.

Just one question, if you don't mind. Who are you? Or better question would be are you guys (part) of the Swedish comp makers?
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Re: The ninth age

Postby spikyandy » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:45 am

I'd welcome a change to the miscast system. It can be incredibly frustrating trying to do a number of smaller spells only toiscast on two dice and ruin the whole phase.
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Re: The ninth age

Postby Chris Legg » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:51 am

Swedes? What do you guys know about Warhammer? :lol:

I cant wait to see what you come up with.
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Re: The ninth age

Postby AndyONeill » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:56 am

Good luck in your project.

I can't help but feel that WFB is a bad starting point for making a good set of rules.
They are fundamentally an indifferent design - in my opinion.
I appreciate a lot of people enjoy playing the game.
Would they not enjoy playing a better set of rules at least as much though?

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Lagge » Tue Jun 30, 2015 7:58 am

AndyONeill wrote:Good luck in your project.

I can't help but feel that WFB is a bad starting point for making a good set of rules.
They are fundamentally an indifferent design - in my opinion.
I appreciate a lot of people enjoy playing the game.
Would they not enjoy playing a better set of rules at least as much though?


They realm is great, the rules are bad. The idea of big armies clashing is great, they way they do it is strange. We intend to change this somewhat, and make good rules, made for competitive play.
ETC '11 Montreux, Switzerland: Team Sweden DoC player
ETC '12 Gorzow, Poland: Team Sweden OnG player
ETC '13 Novi Sad, Serbia: Team Sweden Skaven player
ETC '14 Novi Sad, Serbia: Team Sweden Dark elf player. WINNERS!!
ETC '15 Prague, Czech Republic: Team Sweden Wood Elf player
Co founder of the swedish comp system
Co Founder of The Ninth Age

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orion 76
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Re: The ninth age

Postby orion 76 » Tue Jun 30, 2015 8:09 am

derm wrote:Bravo. The community needs to look after itself now. =D>


This.


If blood bowl did it, so can we.
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Re: The ninth age

Postby Goatman » Tue Jun 30, 2015 8:17 am

Good idea, BUT its like the fourth time I read someone's going to re-do the ruleset and armies.
If everyone starts building his own customhammer, we'll end up killing the game. That's why I think this rework should be tackled by the whole warhammer community, specially the ETC one, which is the one focusing on balancing the armies.

If you guys want to/have the time to lead a global project, thats fine for me, but make sure you get the active support from the whole ETC community.

I hope this leads to something :wink:

PS: in case you want to do a Beastmen rework, I have a whole bunch of ideas to balance the army!

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Re: The ninth age

Postby MosiphTheBetrayer » Tue Jun 30, 2015 8:54 am

Goatman wrote:Good idea, BUT its like the fourth time I read someone's going to re-do the ruleset and armies.
If everyone starts building his own customhammer, we'll end up killing the game. That's why I think this rework should be tackled by the whole warhammer community, specially the ETC one, which is the one focusing on balancing the armies.

If you guys want to/have the time to lead a global project, thats fine for me, but make sure you get the active support from the whole ETC community.

I hope this leads to something :wink:

PS: in case you want to do a Beastmen rework, I have a whole bunch of ideas to balance the army!


This would be a big problem, 4 or 5 different teams all doing different rule sets, I said about a year ago someone should set a team up and make Warhammer 8.5 because the community had really in all honesty left the company behind..... I got laughed at.
Really hope this works out, ETC is the best Warhammer I've ever played so I have confidence you guys could make a fantastic game.

Also, 'd love to have some imput into Beastmen too ;)

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scalebug
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Re: The ninth age

Postby scalebug » Tue Jun 30, 2015 11:11 am

I say more action, less saying on forums you are going to do something... :D

You are already designing by committee in your own group, with all the issues that brings, don't further sandbag yourself by asking for the interwebs input for the sake of it, the benefit is not enough...

So, do it, put it out there, if it is any good people will adopt it.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Logan054 » Tue Jun 30, 2015 11:29 am

I don't see the issue with it, I think if everyone is happy enough to play 8th with all its flaws, I can't see why anyone would have an issue playing a fan updated one which was open to feedback after being used at some events.

It would be cool if the first release also updated older lores from armybooks that don't have spell types.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby jouso » Tue Jun 30, 2015 12:49 pm

As long as it's some minor tweaks to what 8th edition became I feel it can be the default standard for those who'd rather keep playing mass battles.

You have a lot of credit already being one of the people behind Swedish comp so for sure you can count on our group for whatever feedback, playtest, whatever we can help you on.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby phierlihy » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:06 pm

ZOMG! The ETC-gods have invented a reason for their continued existence and the new game hasn't even been released yet. That exceeds even my expectations (I thought it would take about two weeks after the new game was released).

So...how do you plan on using GWs intellectual property and not getting sued by said company?

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scalebug
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Re: The ninth age

Postby scalebug » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:14 pm

phierlihy wrote:ZOMG! The ETC-gods have invented a reason for their continued existence and the new game hasn't even been released yet. That exceeds even my expectations (I thought it would take about two weeks after the new game was released).

So...how do you plan on using GWs intellectual property and not getting sued by said company?


(To be honest, this was my initial response as well, but I rolled a dice; 4+ and I'd be mildly encouraging instead... :))

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Killax » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:18 pm

Still... Looking forward to the brew.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Rillix » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:25 pm

phierlihy wrote:So...how do you plan on using GWs intellectual property and not getting sued by said company?
Pretty sure you could have a fan made rules pack for non profit hobby games.
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Re: The ninth age

Postby Firebat » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:33 pm

Goatman wrote:Good idea, BUT its like the fourth time I read someone's going to re-do the ruleset and armies.
If everyone starts building his own customhammer, we'll end up killing the game. That's why I think this rework should be tackled by the whole warhammer community, specially the ETC one, which is the one focusing on balancing the armies.

If you guys want to/have the time to lead a global project, thats fine for me, but make sure you get the active support from the whole ETC community.

I hope this leads to something :wink:

PS: in case you want to do a Beastmen rework, I have a whole bunch of ideas to balance the army!


No that's how it should be. Everyone that's interested should put up their own thing and if it's good enough or enough people like it then it will float to the top. I mean that's what GW have told you that you should be doing, that their rules should be a starting point, for as long as i've been playing. It's not a bad thing having lots of groups playing by different rules as long as it's made clear what's being used before you start out (Be that an individual games, a local club or a tournament). What will kill things is having a small group of people who think they know best because if you don't agree with them then there is no alternative and that will drive people away.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby scalebug » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:46 pm

Between notes of "XYZ is a registred trademark of Games Workshop, used without permission, no something-something intended" and limiting it to refering to the 8th ed book and having your pack being of the type "Page XX, add 'Type Direct damage' to Skaven Spell x", rather than copypasting an existing publication believing that it is free to do so now it is out of print (which is not how it works), you'll be fine.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby O'Moran » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Hi Lagge, I wanted to share a thought about your idea.

First of all, i like it. Just to makle it clear. A fan made rulebook is what could save the hobby.

Second, i'm asking myself: why should I play a fan made 8th edition when I can simply stay with 8th edition and ETC composition or swedish comp? Isn't is something it already exists?

Why not take an harder challenge: restart from the end of storm of chaos.

That timeline had been retconned by GW. But a set of home rules made to play in that setting, based upon 6th edition (with the improvements we learned in the last 10 years), wouldn't be something actually different (and better) than replicate the 8th edition?

If you want to discuss it, I'll be pleased to share a thought or two.

Bye.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby pforson » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:49 pm

First off. Brilliant! Thanks so much for taking the initiative. A living rulebook a la Bloodbowl is exactly what's required to keep WFB alive.

The main difficulty I forsee, is convincing people to trust the new rules and not question them. As soon as something is 'unofficial' everyone has an opinion.

At least when the rules came from GW, people had to just accept them, even if the rules were stupid.

I think Bloodbowls living rulebook garnered acceptance because it was approved by the creator Jervis Johnson (I believe he was consulted and wrote a foreward for the rulebook). Maybe try to involve one of the older Warhammer creators who have now left GW?

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Viruk » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:51 pm

pforson wrote:At least when the rules came from GW, people had to just accept them, even if the rules were stupid.

Haha, have you ever heard of the ETC? People haven't been accepting stupid GW rules since forever.
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Re: The ninth age

Postby pforson » Tue Jun 30, 2015 1:57 pm

Viruk wrote:
pforson wrote:At least when the rules came from GW, people had to just accept them, even if the rules were stupid.

Haha, have you ever heard of the ETC? People haven't been accepting stupid GW rules since forever.


Yes, obviously.

But not everyone agreed with ETC. I've read hundreds of posts from people who refused to use ETC rules because they didn't like them. It's much easier to 'do things by the book', even if the book is imperfect.

This was exactly my point. It will remain difficult to convince the sceptics.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Herminard » Tue Jun 30, 2015 2:47 pm

I condone of this project =D>

If design by comittee it must be, why not have the swedes do it? A quirky lot of nerdy fellows that aim for a mix of brainy competetive fun and still include the olympic ideals of how the actual winning is the lesser part to the game. After all, isnt the essential thing of life and warhammer not to have conquered but to have fought well?

-H-

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Gharnukk » Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:04 pm

This is going to turn out great. We already have the Swedish comp system. And people are pretty happy about that (I think). Then imagine an updated version of Warhammer, the ninth age. That will be updated by people who actually love the hobby. Who also have great experience with Swedish comp. I dont care how many who
will try to do their own updates. This is what I will go on with.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Logan054 » Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:05 pm

If the swedes could make a warhammer version of the daemonkin I'd be more than happy to play :)

They certainly have the most enjoyable comps I've played.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby grahf » Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:11 pm

Praise the Chaos Gods!

I am sure you can fix this game for good, your previous comp system was/is really sweet.

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Herminard » Tue Jun 30, 2015 3:30 pm

Also.. dont get me wrong - AoS migth be fun too. By the current looks of it im thinking a drinking sidegame with shots for rerolls as a sidegame on saturday night to get the current leader of the tournament hammered..

-H-

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Re: The ninth age

Postby Justa » Tue Jun 30, 2015 6:10 pm

There is a chance to marginally contribute to rules? I have a lot of ideas on how to turn up this game. I played through editions (from third) then I left in 7th, because game start to turn into something I don't like more. I always dreamed of a community edition, and now with AoS I know someone will be turning this way and I am happy of that ;)


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