When should we address the EW or MW problem?

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby 96mgb » Tue Jan 30, 2018 7:08 am

Trick armoured fist is 100% out for Apr so will be available.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Tue Jan 30, 2018 7:25 am

I understand there is an issue with the player base, it was to be expected. But still, the players normally attending the ETC know what this is about, they usually do make an effort to be there for the ETC, so I am sure they understand EW is still worth playing. I personally think it would be a pity to skip EW, as it does bring a lot of fun to the table, with "exotic" armies and nations having a strong presence, unlike in MW or LW. Besides, people have already started buying EW stuff.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby sovietpride » Tue Jan 30, 2018 8:11 am

Well apparently V4 EW and V4 MW are both excellent solutions for this year ETC... so perhaps the best option is continuing the debate between them for months.

That, together with continual calls that «this is a sacrificial year» will surely rally the diminishing player base, but only if we keep positive. :)
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Tenente Paco » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:04 am

sovietpride wrote:Well apparently V4 EW and V4 MW are both excellent solutions for this year ETC... so perhaps the best option is continuing the debate between them for months.

Dude you really need to find yourself a girlfriend. :!:

What I see is happening is that the "veterans" are not eager to play V4. Switching to MW will maybe give captains the opportuity to enlist those "few" new players that are playing V4 or tha are approching the game.

A MW ETC will have an easier to fix info-pack. I believe it will be easier to build up a community, and a then a team, knowing that a big international tournament will take place using the period Battlefront it is promoting!

Would it be bad to ask to put up a vote about it?
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:58 am

I think it will kill small communities who evolve around the ETC. People who have bought Japanese or Finnish or French armies for nothing would now have to buy new Africa armies for The ETC. They would have to get adjusted to not using Forces. All the work done in the last 5 months would be for nothing. This would make a lot of people angry and cause even more attendance issues.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby sovietpride » Tue Jan 30, 2018 10:07 am

Apparently all the possible issues were already know in August and the decision to play V4 EW was taken with full knowledge of what will happen.

If this is true the captain council acted in an irresponsible, almost suicidal manner. This of course is just my POV, others believe things were done in the best possible way.

The fact is that we have needed 6 months to have a V4 EW rulespack voted... if we now re open the process to change it to V4 MW we will surely be debating the new rulespack until june.

This seems to be the best way of creating uncertainty and turning FOW ETC 2018 into a great failure.

But hey, aparently «I dont have a girlfriend», so dont follow my advice ;)
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby DaveM » Tue Jan 30, 2018 11:41 am

Sovietpride, are you going to Zagreb?
As you point out, those of us actually going had a pretty good idea this would be a difficult transitional year and voted V4 EW with our eyes open.
If you are not going to Zagreb then may I ask you to desist from posting about something you will not be involved in and let us _participants_ address issues as they arise.
Thank you.

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Jonny65 » Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:42 pm

ETC 2018 was always going to be a problem for FoW. We had the choice of an outdated system or an untried (but current) system. While I prefer V3 to V4, I still think that going with the latter was the right move. I also think that EW was the correct decision, judging it better to put up with it for this year, and playing the finished product version of MW in 2019. It does mean that we will lose some teams this year (including mine), but I think that numbers would have been down anyway. On the plus side these losses will be partly offset by the return of some teams that we haven't seen for a year or two.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby sovietpride » Tue Jan 30, 2018 1:35 pm

Dave, at this moment in time I have the same chances as everybody of going to FOW ETC in Zagreb... since apparently all the elements of the rulespack are once again open to debate, and we dont even have enough confirmed teams to guarantee the event will actually take place.

But even if I didnt actually went to Zagreb in the end, Im the standing captain of team FOW... and my duty is to organise a qualifier for those players willing to go to Zagreb.

The qualifier has already been delayed waiting for the approval of the rulespack for EW... and now we dont even know if this document will be valid for this years tournament.

So, with which rulespack should we organice the qualifier to prepare for the ETC? The current one? Should we wait for a vote thar might or might not change the event rules?

I just wanna know when the rulespack will be finally settled.

Are the defenders of the MW option going to actually put forward a vote or they are just muddling the water and creating uncertainty for everyboby?
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby M1le » Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:08 pm

@sovietpride: Why are you such a poop stirrer? I actually think you enjoy wreaking havoc on purpose.

The points and period has been voted on. The rules pack has been confirmed and voted on. Period. That's all any team needs to know. Take it or leave it. Don't spread your own insecurities amongst the rest of the community. The bare minimum to make the ETC work is 8 teams. If it's only 8 teams present, it's fine with me. More would be better, but changing the period to MW would not a change a thing. #-o

The amount of confirmed teams is meaningless as their are so many teams that haven't said a word in weeks on this forum. The forum is dead as it has been in the previous years this time of the year. Stop it already with this toxicity and constant nagging.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Lynx » Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:44 pm

M1le wrote:@sovietpride: Why are you such a poop stirrer? I actually think you enjoy wreaking havoc on purpose.

The points and period has been voted on. The rules pack has been confirmed and voted on. Period. That's all any team needs to know. Take it or leave it. Don't spread your own insecurities amongst the rest of the community. The bare minimum to make the ETC work is 8 teams. If it's only 8 teams present, it's fine with me. More would be better, but changing the period to MW would not a change a thing. #-o

The amount of confirmed teams is meaningless as their are so many teams that haven't said a word in weeks on this forum. The forum is dead as it has been in the previous years this time of the year. Stop it already with this toxicity and constant nagging.


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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Tue Jan 30, 2018 2:56 pm

Milan put it best.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby graham » Tue Jan 30, 2018 3:27 pm

Amen to that.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby DaveM » Tue Jan 30, 2018 6:01 pm

Trick08 wrote:Mmmmm

Seems like it is going to be a pretty small event, long way for us to come for a small event, so we have some growing reservations in our team with this kind of talk.

Maybe we all jus need to have a year off without penalty to let FOW settle back into a decent place...or not...and focus on making 2019 a great FOW year?

To be honest it would not feel right to play with some of the Big Guns out.

I call for a vote to cancel FOW at ETC for 2018 and to have a lay over for all teams to 2019.

Trick Team Australia


Trick,

I've sent you a PM on this forum.

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby sovietpride » Tue Jan 30, 2018 9:30 pm

Im not wreaking havoc... Im simply asking if those that opened this post to shift into MW are going to call for a vote or not.

Aparently thats not going to happen, so thats fine for me.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby TheTonyDavis » Wed Jan 31, 2018 1:03 am

I am not a captain so I can’t. Troll somewhere else hermit!!!
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby sovietpride » Wed Jan 31, 2018 8:21 am

Tony, since Im still captain I can call the vote on your behalf.

If you still consider the issue to be important, send me a PM.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Wed Jan 31, 2018 9:04 pm

OK guys, so how long are we going to debate this until we can have some certainty ?

As I was saying, it's chaos and uncertainty that is killing this summer's ETC, not V4 and not EW. We need to take responsibility for our decisions, stop the blame game and STICK TO A PLAN. Any plan is better than this.

We have the following options:

1 - We stick to EW v4, we take the risk of a diminished attendance, we try to make the best of it and Zagreb and enjoy the dynamics of EW without the usual pressure.

2 - We go with MW, which is probably the better gaming experience, but run the risk of pissing a lot of people off who already made preparations for EW (like buying armies and all). Other serious disadvantages are a lack of diversity for lists and the lack of a List Builder.

But we need to make a decision fast. If you guys want to put MW to a vote, do it now. Mobilize the needed number of captains and do it, but let us get this over with and return to planning, purchasing and testing. Anything else is really disrespecting the ETC community of players.

As a personal opinion, I wish to stick with EW V4, but I have a lot of respect and trust for both Tony (who made the proposal here) and Michal (who made it on FB), both as players and as persons, so that I am not completely opposed to a change if experienced and balanced players strongly believe there is need of a change. But I urge them to go this way only if they are 100% sure it will cause more good than harm (which I do not believe, at the moment).

As a captain, I am coming under pressure from the community and the team to press for a clear course of action. The ETC is a serious effort and people need to know what they have to do. And I am certain that players all over smaller countries and communities feel the same. For us, it is all about the ETC, less about V3 vs V4. It is somewhat shocking to me that the ETC has such small attraction to French or German players that such important countries are not attending due to a lack of players. I am not being judgemental here, just somewhat baffled.

So let us just commit to a course of action. My suggestion is to stick with the current plan and the rulespack which was prepared by an elected committee of trusted players and voted on by captains. But if a change is to be made, let it be made now. If not, let us make the best of this year and have fun in Zagreb, without all the destructive negativity. Yes, we are all disappointed by the way BF handled the transition, yes, V4 is not everyone's cup of tea, but I am confident that things will settle down, we only need to have a bit of patience and confidence. And loosen up a bit on the blame game and scapegoating, as it really helps no one.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Trick08 » Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:08 am

I have already called for a vote to switch to MW or stay EW...so if there are other Captians who feel the same...start seconding it:-)

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Thu Feb 01, 2018 6:50 am

I have already called for a vote to switch to MW or stay EW...so if there are other Captians who feel the same...start seconding it:-)

Trick


Do you mean in this thread ? Because if yes, then it may have gotten lost among the other replies. Perhaps you should open another one with specifically this purpose.

We also need a deadline. Because if you get your desired number of captains in April, it should not really count. As I keep stating, we need a final resolution fast, so I urge all captains (and all players who support this to pressure their captains) to respond as fast as possible to this issue so we may see if we have the vote or not. If Trick calls for a vote, how much time does he have to get his 9 backers ? People, especially captains, especially those who advocate for a change at this time, should be active and present, so absenteism due to it being February should not be a reason to delay a final decision.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby graham » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:44 am

I want to stick with EW v4 and I do not want a further vote.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Rugi » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:52 am

Moving to MW now would not solve much so I am for sticking with EW.

Additionaly:
- there are not many lists in MW
- The team limitations would have to be thrown out the window or a new rulespack written
- Many of us already made purchases and trained with the armies for EW.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Arkon » Thu Feb 01, 2018 10:54 am

Same here
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby DaveM » Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:11 am

Team NZ would not support a revote.
We knew this was a transitional year and our attitude as perennial tadpoles is to go for the fun and meeting friends rather than the gaming experience which will be "mixed" sadly.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Lynx » Thu Feb 01, 2018 11:15 am

Same here I want to stick to V4 EW.

Oh and by the way France is not passing this year it's only me who can't attend for personal reasons nothing to do with V4 and EW. I have a replacement and he is gathering a team. Until he officially takes the captaincy I do the job here.
So yes switching to MW would pee him off as most people already invested in EW stuff.

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Adamastor » Thu Feb 01, 2018 2:34 pm

Wow, I had no idea this would still be going on!!!

Let me explain our stance over here in Portugal:

- Has an official vote chosen period and rules version? - Check

- Has a rulespack been voted and aproved? - Check

Have both decisions been what we would want? No, but there is this thing called a DEMOCRACY, where the majority of votes decide. And we are great believers in it.

After those votes were done, everybody started working on armies, and the logistics of the trip, as usual.

At this point we have about 75% of the minis are aquired and painted, and the plane tickets bought, as usual.

Its probably gonna be the year where we'll be less competitive, we're iffy on the rules, and some of our army choices are bound to be unorthodox, but the ETC is not only for that, its for the EXPERIENCE.

And if people dont understand that, thats their loss...

So, in short, yes, Portugal will be in Zagreb! (and I'm sure that like us, other teams are just quietly going about their business, preparing for the event, without feeling the need to tell everyone that they will atend!!!)

Grow up, people!!!
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Thu Feb 01, 2018 5:01 pm

Its probably gonna be the year where we'll be less competitive, we're iffy on the rules, and some of our army choices are bound to be unorthodox, but the ETC is not only for that, its for the EXPERIENCE.

And if people dont understand that, thats their loss...

So, in short, yes, Portugal will be in Zagreb! (and I'm sure that like us, other teams are just quietly going about their business, preparing for the event, without feeling the need to tell everyone that they will atend!!!)

Grow up, people!!!


Amen to that.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Trick08 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:13 am

Then we have achieved what we wanted to achieve...no voted needed now IMO, so I have teams confirmed as going at somewhere near 15?

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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Dirkhrod » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:14 am

Here is what I have gathered until now:


Confirmed in the forum:
England, Greece, Romania, Slovenia, New Zeeland, Portugal, Russia

Going (not 100% confirmed in the forum):
Croatia, Poland, France, USA, Italy, Serbia, Denmark, Australia, Scotland

Not going:
South Africa, Germany, Wales, Canada, Northern Ireland, Ireland

No asnwer (came to Salamanca):
Austria, Switzerland, Spain, Finland, Netherlands

No answer (did not come to Salamanca):
Hungary, Turkey, Czech Republic, Sweden, Belarus
Last edited by Dirkhrod on Sat Feb 03, 2018 7:16 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: When should we address the EW or MW problem?

Postby Fallgelb » Fri Feb 02, 2018 5:13 pm

Team Ireland are not attending this year. (Our original reply on this was on the Team NI withdrawal thread)
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