MSU HE - KoW - Kings of Dave 4 - vs Abyssal Dwarfs - 05/06

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - deployment

Postby Swordmaster » Wed Mar 18, 2015 2:12 am

Hi RaZer,

I definitely agree! That spell is scary and seems to be designed to kill small units in particular. The fact it can be recast means even bigger regiments may suffer when winds of magic blow strong.

The way I saw it before the game was that I had two options. Go defensive and minimize the impact of the spell while trying to hit back with ranged attacks or go aggressive and try to get his units in close combat fast. I opted to go for the attack because I thought I will have speed with cavalry to reach soft skinks and maybe even Cold One Riders (since they were not supported by scar vet).

I will do my best to finish the report quickly so that we can see how that worked :)

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - deployment

Postby RaZeR » Wed Mar 18, 2015 12:09 pm

Yeah, that's a clearer way of saying what I was trying to say :D
I suspected you'd go for the more offensive option, seems to be your style!

Hope it worked :P
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - deployment

Postby Squigkikka » Thu Mar 19, 2015 12:32 pm

I'll expand on this once I get to work but I think you're pretty much screwed this game, and I think you'll lose with a 17-3 :P


Edit: So, at work! And reading his list, and looking at that deployment I fear you might be setting up for perfect ruination of Elven troops. You've spread all across the table- I was hoping you'd use your deployment advantage to really bunker down in a corner and deny him opportunity for the lower range Deliverances.

He's got high comp, which makes avoidance trickier though. Also, he can use the skinks as delivery systems for the Deliverance, which makes denying it even harder... but you managed to minimize that advantage of his, since one is next to Kroak and the other is on the wrong flank.

I think your RBTs are placed poorly, unable to get good flankshots off on potentially advancing dudes and if they're charged, one can be overrun into the other.

Try to minimize the loss, do not commit against the big Saurus. Take out Skinks and Cold Ones if you can and accept that this matchup is erk, and that you're at best getting a draw. Play mega defensively, back off, chuck out fireballs from the Loremaster. Use Miasma to lower Kroak movement!

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Swordmaster » Fri Mar 20, 2015 6:45 am

Hi guys!

Thanks a lot for the feedback! Now that the report is ready I guess we can discuss your very accurate (unfortunately for me!) predictions!

@ RaZeR

As you could see I totally failed. The more I think about it the more I am convinced I simply made a mistake in assessing my chances. I have no idea why I thought I can succeed. #-o Even with average rolls for 2d6 S4 hits I was in trouble anyway.

I guess I need to resist the urge of throwing my troops forward recklessly and consider the battle with a more cold blooded attitude :)

@ Squigkikka

Not sure what brackets range you are using but I assume 1000+VP difference is more or less 17-3! :)

It is a little disturbing to see that many people (here and Ulthuan) didn't think I can do well against that army. I am of course not surprised given the way Lord Kroak works but at the same time it seems my skills are not convincing enough to show that I can come up with a good plan. I further reinforced it with my poor performance and I guess I need to get back to warhammer boot camp!

Well, as to the positioning of Bolt Throwers there is a little more to the story. We agreed that the terrain they are in is impassable at the start. I put my bolt throwers there but during the game my opponent raised a question, can war machines be deployed in impassable terrain? It was important because he intended to charge them while otherwise he could not. We asked a referee for a judgement and he was not sure either so we decided during the game to change the terrain type to dangerous and I could reposition the machines.

I simply thought I could place them in a save position as they could not be attacked but I guess that's not fair and I should have thought it through better.

Indeed, I need to better assess the chances and what is possible to achieve. I made stupid mistake and the rest was playing right into my opponents hands. :oops: #-o

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Edzig » Fri Mar 20, 2015 10:14 am

I've faced Kroak once with well-armoured Dwarfs and even then the damage was horrendous. Mostly I'm amazed at how you manage to wriggle out of defeat in bad match ups - and sometimes even win - but this time the odds were too heavily stacked against the MSU elves. Even if you'd gone defensive, I don't see how you could keep much of your infantry out of range of that spell for six turns.

If you had a bit of a sad face on, I'm not surprised! Don't let it get you down and please keep playing and reporting on your games! [-o<

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Squigkikka » Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:00 pm

It is a little disturbing to see that many people (here and Ulthuan) didn't think I can do well against that army. I am of course not surprised given the way Lord Kroak works but at the same time it seems my skills are not convincing enough to show that I can come up with a good plan.


You give yourself both too much and too little credit at the same time, which is quite silly :P

I think anyone who looks at the rules for Lord Kroak and then your army realizes that you're pretty much going to lose this game solely on matchup. Sometimes that's how Warhammer is, despite the skills of the players. You're a good player Swordmaster, and it's not due to a lack in belief that you can win games, that people come to the conclusion that you're almost guaranteed a loss- that's where you give yourself too little credit. The forum censor doesn't properly convey how erk your MSU Elf army is against this type of opposition, especially since his small units are going to be a [bip] to take out (and still are worth nothing).

If you think your supposed prowess with tactics and strategy could've pulled out a win however, then you think highly of yourself indeed :P This game is lost- I think it's a skill in realizing some harsh truths during the games and playing according them (see the Reaver sacrifice in a prior game- it looks like a horrible trade, but it had to be done). If you had more keenly seen the game for what it was (lose with as little as possible) I think you could've showed your skill at movement and maneuvering by minimizing losses and dragging his troops in the wrong directions. As it is, you thought you could pull out a win and walked right into him without a realistic plan.

So... it's not people doubring you, Swordie- although if you try to take on Kroak in this manner again, I'll probably have some doubts.

Also! How many times has your eagle rider died to a failed panic test from the unit he's in? He flies damnit, he can be anywhere you want him to be, put him in range of the BSB! :P

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Silas7 » Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:47 pm

Squigkikka covered most of what I wanted to say: Looking at the armies on paper alone, the lizardmen have a big advantage. Your usual tactic of surround and combo charging won't work here, because Kroak's spell affects units in combat, can be cast multiple times, and you only have +2 to dispel.

It's less that people think you're not a good enough general and more that you have a very difficult challenge, and once we saw your deployment we knew the game was over. Everyone has a brain fart now and again (look at my last tournament report, where I 20-0ed a Ogre player game 1 and was lucky to get 7-13 against ogres in my last game).

You could have deployed your bolt throwers well back, and your archers about 30" away from his troops, and back them up each turn. Scatter your units as much as you can, to minimize the damage you're taking from Kroak's spell. Try not to engage any of his units until at least turn 5, that way you only have one round of being pinned and affected by the spell.

If you are looking at a really bad match up, one strategy is to divide your army into two parts in either corner of the board. Your opponent can get at best half your army, and you can maybe kills some things with magic and shooting.

Putting your war machines in the middle of impassable terrain is a dodgy thing to do. ;) If it's impassable, how did you get the machines there in the first place? No, using eagles to carry your war machines doesn't count, neither does magic. ;)

Two more reports to go, two more chances at glory!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Squigkikka » Fri Mar 20, 2015 4:24 pm

Lord Kroaks spell doesn't work against targets in combat though, it's a direct damage spell that targets everyone within X inches. Still, even setting up the positions for the multicharges means exposing yourself to it.

Silas has the right of it though! You should've deployed on the very table edge with your stuff to delay him for as long as you can. Miasma on Kroak for minus movement, and Fireballs for the support units.

The spell can look overwhelming, but it's not THAT amazing- it's very niche. Don't forget that he's giving up a lot of other killer spells for it, and often turn 1-2 you can avoid it a lot easier if properly deployed.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Silas7 » Fri Mar 20, 2015 4:56 pm

My last opponent told me Kroak's spell worked on units in combat too. Glad to know he is wrong!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Squigkikka » Fri Mar 20, 2015 5:57 pm

Yeah, same! I met Kroak in the final game of a tagteam tournament, and they also claimed it worked in close combat- it's how they'd played and won the four prior games :P It's the wording that throws some people off, but it's important that the description mentions "targets all units within X" since you can never target units in close combat with direct damage spells.

We were the first ones to dispute the claim, and we got the rules judge on our side too. Still, it's a scary spell for some armies!

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Swordmaster » Sat Mar 21, 2015 4:40 am

Thanks for the feedback guys! :)

@ Edzig

I must say one of the things I struggled with is the assumption that something cannot be done. Like - you cannot win against Lord Kroak. :) It is anathema to me and if you want to make sure I am going to do something tell me I cannot, haha!

Having said that I do understand the merit of assessing the chances appropriately. Fortunately it is just a game but it still looks like one reckless and arrogant general threw away many lives of his warriors because he ordered the attack when it was simply a suicide.

It is quite possible then that I should be able to apply another rule to my games "Make sure you don't lose first, then think how to win" :)

It is important to me that my opponents enjoy playing against me. Even more so if they are my friends and I simply realized that I may take away from that enjoyment by being grumpy. I hope I regained my composure before the game ended but I am sure my friend Jamie could tell I was turning into Longbeard :) So no worries, such game is not going to stop me from playing and reporting! I just need to take the lessons with lighter mood, that's all :)

@ Squigkikka

I am sure I had something clever in mind but it was lost in translation and I simply ended up sounding like a pansy Elf I am :D Sorry about that, it was never an intention!

As I said above I need to accept there are games were winning is a very improbable event and the first thing I should take care of is minimizing the losses and hopefully not to lose. Only then I should try and plan on how to do something that might give me some bonus, maybe even enough to claim a victory.

I guess I don't quite like absolute statements. On one hand I understand the value of assessing the most probable outcome of the game. On the other I find it inflexible when people focus on match up process so much they assume certain outcome as if the game was already finished.

And that motivates me more to try something to show it is not as "interntetz says" :)

But that does not mean I should be reckless and I was in that game. I have nothing against being underdog in any and all my games. When I succeed in defeating my opponent in such game it makes the victory even sweater! Unfortunately, although I knew Jamie has a great tool against my army while even without it I would need to work hard to get some kills, I still played in the first 2 turns as if there was no Lord Kroak present. And that is bad performance.

I would love to come with some clever plan that nobody expects and at least make the game interesting. This time I didn't. But I guess I expressed my frustration with lack of good ideas in a poor way, haha!

Btw, it was mounted noble that fled this time. Eagle rider was in the range of BSB :P But I presume the principle is the same. I think in the future I will try to deploy units that are not close to BSB at the edge of the deployment so that if they happen to flee they would at least have better chance at staying on the battle field.

@ Silas7

Yeap, I totally agree. As I tried to explain, I probably had something interesting to say but ended up in whinging like a HE :D

Spreading forces, keeping the distance and dividing the army into two - these are some great ideas and as I say, I wish I had a chance to play again and improve based on that harsh lesson.

I feel ashamed at that war machines thing. :oops: Although for the purpose of joking around "wizard did it" seems legit :D

Yeap, I am preparing photos and maps for game 7 already! I kept you guys waiting for the games too long and I can assure you last two games are quite interesting indeed!

Deliverance of Itza interpretation

I read the spell description a few times and I was wondering what is your interpretation. On one hand it is direct damage spell which means the possible targets are in the front arc of the caster. On the other, it also says all units in certain radius. My first impression was that you can target all enemy units provided they are in the front arc but one of the TO's told me it is still in radius.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 6 - 20.03

Postby Swordmaster » Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:53 am

Game 7 - Battle for the Pass - James - Beastmen

After tough day 2 I was ready to turn the tide and fight for some better results during the last day of the tournament. Game 1 of the day and 7th in general was played with Battle for the Pass scenario rules and I had a pleasure to play against James and his Beastie Boyz! :)

I have a great respect for people who use Beastmen not because it is considered a weak army ( I think it is not) but because they have guts to bring the force that looks great even if it is not that popular. I never underestimate them and the player that plays that army as it often happens that he is actually a very good gamer who knows how to use his army.

These are the details of the army I was fighting against:

Beastmen - Army List

Beastlord, Shield, Brass Cleaver, Armour of Destiny, Dragonbane Gem, Uncanny Senses - 243
Great Brayshaman, Level 4, Shard of the Herdstone, Staff of Darkoth - 335 - Lore of Beasts

Wargor, Battle Standard, Heavy Armour, Shield, Gnarled Hide, The Beast Banner - 206
Slugtongue - 190
Brayshaman, Obsidian Trinket - 110 - Lore of Beasts
Brayshaman, Scroll of Shielding - 90 - Lore of Shadow

28 Gors, Full Command, Additional Hand Weapons - 249
15 Gors, Full Command, Additional Hand Weapons - 145
9 Ungor Raiders, Champion, Musician - 63
Tuskgor Chariot - 80
Tuskgor Chariot - 80
5 Warhounds - 30

27 Bestigors, Full Command, Razor Standard - 399
5 Harpies, Scouts - 70

Chaos Spawn - 55
Chaos Spawn - 55

Swedish Comp: 15.6

It looked like a typical Beastmen force to me, based around infantry and magic with nice selection of the support. Let's have a look at the choices James made in more details:

Beastlord - this character is not that popular as he competes with Doombulls or level 4 Shaman for the place in the army. However, with T5 and 4+ ward he is already tough enough to survive a few attacks. Brass cleaver adds more attacks per each enemy in contact so I can assume he will have 7A with S5 with primal fury on top of that. He alone will chop through my units easily. The good thing is he is infantry model and will stay with his unit unlike flying doombull for example, so he can be contained.

Great Brayshaman - main spell caster of the army and he chose Beast Lore. It means my opponents is not going to stay away from combats as the lack of armor for beastmen can be mitigated with higher toughness. Their attacks will also count more with a least S4, in particular against fragile Elves. Lore of the beasts has some nice magic missiles too and in addition to that he also have the Staff that adds 5d6 S1 attacks which can be nasty against war machines for example.

BSB - Typical configuration with 2+ armor save and Beast Banner! He will make any gor unit very dangerous already while boosting their strength further with beast magic will make them really hard hitting regiment! While not easy to kill I will have to do my best to eliminate him because his banner makes any combat much more dangerous. Noble with Star Lance will have him as a target for sure!

Slugtongue - he adds to already great selection of spells of the army. Magic phase domination belongs to Beastmen this game and I actually hoped that the winds will be strong as with all the channels and extra dice I will need as many as possible to dispel anything. But his main danger comes from the special rule that allows him to roll for every unit in the enemy army and apply damage on 4+ with even more on 6+. With MSU force it can be even more devastating but at least my opponent had to roll first :)

Shamen - Great shaman helpers their main role is to generate power dice and stay close to the herdstone. However, with Shadow and Beast Lores they can provide some more options for the player. Beat Lore in particular sounds great because there will be redundancy with Wildform casting or even stacking the effects of it on a single unit. It can result in S6 Gors (with beast banner) or S9 Bestigors!

Gors - two units, one will be a living shield while the horde is there to provide some punch or reform deep and keep the ranks. In both cases they are dangerous to my units. They are fragile and can't take much damage but with T4 to start with and spells to help them get tougher, they can still survive some attacks anyway. And thanks to large number they can soak up damage and hit back way harder to make up for the initial losses. Depending on formation I will need to adapt different approach. Horde can be charged from the front with a few units and will suffer more casualties. Deep formation will have to be engaged from the flanks. Which may be more difficult in the Battle for the Pass scenario.

Ungor Raiders - they will be small bodyguard for the level 1s and that is their main role. Stay out of sight, their skirmish formation allowing them to move faster to avoid potential danger.

Chariots - T5 chariots with 4+ save are always a problem. There are only two but these are not the only threats my army has to face. I will have to be careful not to get charged by them but fortunately my infantry can take on one of them even if charged (well, it is risky since I can lose steadfast in such an attack but that potentially allows for counter charges!). Also, if I can use any of my nobles and cavalry they should be able to deal with them too.

Warhounds - can be annoying so I will use reavers to shot them down if possible while taking positions to harass the enemy.

Bestigors - Elite of the enemy army. With base S6 and primal fury plus Razor Standard these are really hard hitting beasts. And again, have the numbers to soak up the damage and hit back. Their combat prowess can be further boosted by the presence of the characters and the spells. Can only be engaged from the flanks and even then I would need to make sure I have overwhelming forces that can tie the characters and inflict enough damage on the attack.

Harpies - interesting choice with scouting unit, they are one of the priorities for the support units to eliminate as they will either interfere with my movement phase or will attack war machines.

Spawns - more support, this time in the form of mindless creatures with random movement. They are T5 but have nor armor and inflicting 3w on them should not be a problem. However, as with all the support in this army, there are many targets that needs to be eliminated fast.

I think the fact we were playing Battle for the Pass suited my opponent better as he could cover entire width of the table and would not fear the frontal attack. He can advance or stay put and use his magic to inflict damage on my small units at the distance regardless of the option chosen. That creates an interesting challenge where I would need to keep the distance to have time to eliminate support units such as small gors, chariots, spawns and harpies, while I would prefer to attack as soon as possible as that limits the damage I can suffer from magic.

At the same time, after dealing with support (fast enough hopefully) I would prefer to use my own shooting and magic to thin down the enemy so that they are vulnerable to charges even from the front.

I decided that I will do the following. Try to attack in close combat anything but Bestigors. I have speed to do so with cavalry and nobles while infantry will be the second wave. In the meantime, I will deal with the support by any ways that will look viable and use my own support to slow down and divert Bestigors.

It will create a lot of dangerous situations since in the narrow Pass I will not be able to separate units will and I will have to check the possible paths of charges, pursuits and flees much more carefully than usually.

Terrain

Image
Battle field before the deployment

The battle field looked empty in the middle but please, take into account the fact that deployment zones contained all the terrain here and created additional problems in already narrow space. I though I would still prefer the right deployment simply because I could deploy shooters on the hill and keep the line of sight open.

Deployment

Image
Deployment after vanguards

Interestingly, we still deployed in weighted flank formation. I wanted to use the chance to attack with cavalry on the flank and hopefully go through both Gor units since they were deployed wide and they might lose steadfast easier. At the same time chariots would be on the other flank and it would take some time for them to join the combat.

I just made one mistake, forgot about the back yard and didn't put anything to prevent harpies from deploying behind my lines.

Beastmen Shamen got the following spells:

Great Shaman - Wildform, Flock of Doom, Curse, Savage Beasts
Slugtongue - Spirit Leach, Fate of Bjuna
Brayshaman - Wildform
Brayshaman - Miasma

Image
Units affected by SLugtongue

James won the roll-off and his was first turn:

Beastmen - Turn 1

Image
Beastmen set up baits

Image
Harpies take cover

Beastmen didn't move much and sent their expendable units forward instead. Magic was not strong yet and the spells that went through didn't do much damage much to the annoyance of Great Brayshaman. But maybe it was silence before the storm?

Outcasts - Turn 1

Image
Elves - first to fight

Image
Beastmen are steafast

One regiment of the Dragon Princes charged Gors who acted as a living shield. Although they were in the open only one regiment was sent against them to tie them in combat and block the path for the bigger unit behind them. Second unit of the cavalry and Swordmasters closed in to attack as a second wave.

In the meantime, the Loremaster and his archers tried to scare off the harpies but despite enough casualties to do so, flying beasts showed unusual courage and didn't flee.

Beastmen - Turn 2

Image
Bestigor leave the building

Image
Disaster!

Beastmen tried to counter attack. Big gor regiment chased off Reavers who then had to avoid warhounds but were swift enough to outrun both. Then Bestigor moved out of the building to dominate the center. Great Brayshaman cursed nearby dragon princes but in his arrogance took way too much energy from the winds of magic and the spell backfired! The result was truly catastrophic as one third of the unit and Shaman himself were dragged to the parallel dimension.

Outcasts - Turn 2

Image
Elves counter attack

Image
But gors still hold on!

Elven commanders spotted an opportunity to hit the Beastmen from the unexpected direction. It required good coordination. Eagle Rider would attack big units of Gors first. Then, cavalry commander and his unit would attack the spawn in such a way that might lead them into the flank of the same Gor horde in the overrun. Thanks to that Elves wanted to assassinate enemy BSB. However, the air currents were still unstable and the eagle didn't reach the enemy. Seeing that, commander of the cavalry changed the orders in the last moment and they swiftly passed by the enemy regiment after trampling the spawn.

In other areas of the battle field the eagle counter attacked the harpies who managed to kill remaining crewmen of the bolt thrower and even held their ground! White Lions chopped another spawn to pieces.

Beastmen - Turn 3

Image
Exchange of blows continues

Image
Tactical retreat

Both large Beastmen regiments tried to catch reavers but elven fast cavalry performed their feigned flight perfectly. Chariots tried to attack the Lions but they withdrew and one of the chariots got destroyed in the treacherous forest! (Edit: at least I think it did as I can't recall how it disappeared from the pictures!)

Expecting another charge, gors braced for impact and got toughened by the magical efforts of one of the shamen.

Outcasts - Turn 3

Image
Charge!

Image
Horrendous casualties on both sides!

Eagle rider, Dragon Princes and Swordmasters attacked as one. Swordmasters got boosted by the Loremaster too which helped a lot because Beastmen were incredibly tough. Eagle Rider singled out enemy BSB but inflicted only a single wound and the Banner was not destroyed. (Edit: It was very disappointing to hit 3 times and then roll two 1's to wound with Star Lance. I guess it was some poor copy :D)

The casualties on both sides were enormous but Elves won the combat. However, Beastmen were steadfast and kept fighting!

Beastmen - Turn 4

Image
The fight continues

Image
Slugtongue attacks on its own!

Beastlord, annoyed with elven fast cavalry sent Slugtongue on its own to attack the Elves. They held but fled soon after. However, their companions got their back and held against pursuing Shaman.

Bloody combat continued, Elves fell many Beastmen again but there were only a few left to fight. Fortunately, the cavalry was coming!

Outcasts - Turn 4

Image
Heavy cavalry charge

Cavalry commander gave the order and Elven knights stormed into enemy ranks killing them all. It was perfect timing to save remaining Swordmasters and Eagle Rider.

Another group of Swordmasters charged the exposed flank of Bestigors but didn't make it in time. Beastlord, seeing that his forces melted away used the power of nearby Herdstone to withdraw under the cover of magical mist.

Summary

Image
Turn-by-turn summary animation

After-battle thoughts

Unfortunately, we run out of time and had to finish the game with only 4 turns played. I was very happy with the victory but of course I was curious if I could do something to get Bestigors too. Please, note, that I didn't move some of the units in my last turn as we wanted to finish crucial combats.

In any case it was very intense battle full of action. I want to thank James for great game and I am sorry his Great Shaman betrayed him! There is no doubt the game would have been very different if he survived that Cascade.

I was very happy with how I played this game for a change. I like the fact I went for aggressive approach and it paid off. Of course getting two 1's for the star lance was a little bit disappointing :)

I liked a lot how I managed to use fast cavalry to set up double flee reactions that kept Bestigors in the middle of the table doing nothing. It is a very good example of what reavers can do that no other unit in the army can.

The maps and diagrams do not show it well but there were a few opportunities where the order of charges was of an extreme importance. For example, James declared the chariots first when he could have waited. If he declared his gors as attacking first then reavers would have to go into chariots charge range and may have been destroyed in the process too!

I made some mistakes too, main one being the issue with harpies. They should not have been allowed to land behind my lines. Fortunately, I managed to deal with them although they took one of the bolt throwers with them as well.

With 16-4 victory from game 7 I was ready for the last game of the tournament! Thanks for reading!

Cheers!
Last edited by Swordmaster on Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - deployment

Postby Huntsmen » Mon Mar 23, 2015 10:06 am

Being a fellow Beast Buddy I await this particular report with baited breath. The list is a lot closer to the 'traditional' Beastmen list which I find Swed Comp hits hard compared to some options in the book which get away very very lightly. Still a challenege for you put I feel your army has the perfect tools in this match up. His magic relies on being in combat but he doesn't have enough chaff to dictate the fights or speed to put you under enough pressure. You can play the shooting game and pick apart his army which you seem to do with often.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - 23.03

Postby Swordmaster » Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:53 am

Hi Huntsmen,

Thanks! I admit I hoped you would be interested in that game and I wonder how would you play it if you were my opponent? Always great to have an insight from an experienced player!

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - deployment

Postby Squigkikka » Mon Mar 23, 2015 11:58 am

Swordmaster: You don't come across as a pansy elf, but I do think you're maybe not willing to take a matchup for what it is! I think properly assessing your opponents army and playing in accordance is a big strength to have.

Going against 'the internetz' for the sake of going against 'the internetz' isn't a very good way to win games :P You don't like absolute statements, sure, and there's always a chance you can pull off an upset.

That usually means you try to play in a way that minimizes the strength of the opponent though, not by throwing yourself straight into the lions den to prove that maybe lions aren't so bad after all :P


As for the Beastmen game...

I've got a bad feeling about this. Slugtongue doesn't hit everything in the army, but stuff within 36". I feel that some of your key units (knights, eagle, reavers) easily could've been placed out of range at the back of the field. They've got very high movement and after dodging Slugtongues ability at the start of the game, can relocate back to better positions.

It also looks a bit to me like you've placed units within 6" of another. What happens if one of the Reaver units die off? You're forcing a LD check, risky risky... they haven't worked out well for you before! The eagle and RBTs are all within range of one another, and given their low amount of wounds, they seem very likely to die from his ability.

It's hard to tell, but the bottom Eagle Claw, is it in range of the DPs? The DPs seem out of BSB range, and I fear they might lose a panic check and run off. It has happened before!

Overall, I think the lack of options for maneuvering, the tight battlefield, Slugtongue being in range of your entire army and magic dominance will mean a loss for you. You will have a hard time avoiding him and getting flanks off with both of the chariots on the flank there to answer to the WLs and SMs.

However, this is just a bit of personal bias, but in my experience Beastmen players usually aren't very... good at maneuvering. I know it's sort of dumb and prejudist, but only very rarely have I seen a Beastman army well played :P So that might work out for you!

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - 23.03

Postby Silas7 » Mon Mar 23, 2015 8:15 pm

Congratulations on a big win!

Those are a lot of tightly deployed units on the left, but if they are all within general and BSB range it's OK. Battle for the Pass does restrict your deployment options a lot, so this is understandable. If you had deployed further back you could be out of range of Slugtongue's ability, then just rushed forward to close with the beasts. Deploying further back would have made it harder for the harpies to land behind you.

Good use of charging the long line of gor with only one unit, his own troops will keep you safe from counter charges, and give you time to make charges of your own. The reavers were expertly used this game, completely stalling the bestigor. His lvl 4 miscasting was icing on the cake.

Looking forward to the end of the match, and in a week's time I'll have some High Elf action for you to read about!
Chris O'Brien
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - 23.03

Postby Swordmaster » Tue Mar 24, 2015 2:20 am

Hi guys,

Thanks for comments!

@ Squigkikka

I totally agree that being able to properly assess strengths and weaknesses of both armies before the game is very important. What I am against, however, is that tendency of people (somehow ETC practitioners in particular) to state what the match up is before the game starts and then play in the way that will fulfill their prophecy. The good example is a HE player who assumed he has no chance with his dragon against double ironblaster ogres who still charged headlong, got shot down and claimed it had to happen. Where he could have simply hid his dragon and save points.

And no, I am not necessary trying to go against collective knowledge. I just know that this knowledge is not absolute and I am willing to try and find new solutions. In this game against Lizardmen I made a mistake of course but I am willing to make them instead of not even trying.

Another important thing is that at a time of the game I usually am optimistic about the plan. Only during the game I may realize that it was not a good one and I made a mistake. It was the example here, so it is not that I decided to go for it for the sake of doing it either. Now I know it was foolish and that approach does not work. But I also know why I made that decision and where I didn't make the right assessment. Again, the difference being me trying something rather than remaining inactive and accepting your faith just because it is a bad match up.

Beastmen game

I have finished the report so I am curious what would you say about the game and the outcome. Yes, that was risky to deploy so close but I simply recalled the rules wrong. I was under the impression Slugtongue affects the units no matter where they are. I should have clarified that with the opponent who offered any explanation I needed but I assumed I remember correctly. Only when he kept measuring I realized I was wrong.

Majority of units where under the influence of BSB or general or even both. It was risky but with compact deployment zone I could not entirely avoid it so I kept them close to the leaders.

As you see I managed to pull it off but I expect you are going to blame the opponent this time :p

@ Silas7

Thanks! I really needed one if only to start the day in a good mood. :)

All good points about staying out of range from Slugtongue and at the same time denying the landing zone for harpies. I wonder, however, how would that affect the game if we started separated by more than 36" rather than 24". It would require at least one more turn to get back to the position. I am not sure if I would be able to deploy bolt throwers on the hill still and if not that would limit the lines of sight for them.

As I said I am very happy with reavers, have to tip the hat to Kanadian for his great ideas on how to use dark riders in similar roles and I hope it is a good example that shows that only reavers can do it. Many HE player claim Silver Helms are way better but I still disagree. These are two different units and just because they are both in core and may perform similar duties it does not mean they are comparable.

I will do my best to finish last report in two days as I am about to go for holidays but will definitely check your HE reports and I am already looking forward to it!

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 7 - 23.03

Postby Swordmaster » Tue Mar 24, 2015 11:44 am

Game 8 - Battle Line - Tom - Ogre Kingdoms

Finally the report from the last game! This time I met Tom aka Forgebreaker and his Ogres. I haven't played against them for ages so I was looking forward to the battle and I also hoped to finish the tournament with a great game!

Tom had a few usual suspects but there were also a few surprises. Here is his list in more details:

Ogre Kingdoms - Army List

Slaughtermaster, Level 4, ironfist , Armour of Destiny, Gnoblar Thiefstone - Lore of Maw - 383
Bruiser, BSB, great weapon, heavy armour, Greedy Fist, Dragonhelm - 195
Firebelly, great weapon, Sivejir's Hex Scroll - 179
Butcher, Level 2, Ironcurse Icon - Lore of Heavens - 140

9 Ironguts, Full Command, Look-out Gnoblar, Standard of Discipline - 437
10 Gnoblars, Standard, Musician - 45
10 Gnoblars, Standard, Musician - 45
3 Ogres, ironfists - 96

6 Leadbelchers, Bellower - 268
Sabertusk - 21
Sabertusk - 21

Ironblaster - 170
Giant - 200
Giant - 200

Swedish Comp: 15.4

Slaughtermaster - often Ogre's general and there is no exception here. 4++ ward save, T5 and 5W mean that he is hard to kill indeed. On top of that his Gnoblar Thiefstone makes his ward save 2++ against certain spells and helps his bodyguards to survive some attacks too. Stealing some precious items from the enemy is a great bonus too! He has lore of Maw that can be quite good at protecting or making the Ogres stubborn.

BSB - He adds some punch indeed. With greedy fist and great weapon he adds 4 S8 attacks, that hurts. He is not, however, that well protected but the fact Ogres have quite a few wounds and high toughness is a protection in itself. Star Lance hero has a chance to kill him in a single combat though, with Potion of Foolhardiness. But it would be risky as the eagle rider would suffer from the attacks back, either by BSB or the unit he is in.

Firebelly - Always useful with his flaming attacks, breath and lore of fire. His "Toad Scroll" can be quite dangerous for the Loremaster as he is only level 2!

Butcher - another wizard with good magic lore, thanks to that Tom had a very nice spells selection. Heavens is a great lore and with more spells to threaten my army I would need to choose wisely what to dispel.

Ironguts - gut star, with banner of discipline as usual. With any or even all characters in this unit it would be very hard to tackle them. First, I absolutely have to avoid frontal attacks. Only flanks and rear are the directions from which I may risk confrontation. But in order to do that I would need to clear the support first and in this army support troops are formidable on their own. In that case I planned to avoid this regiment and if possible, thin it down until last turn attacks. But in order to succeed I would need to have overwhelming forces to attack with.

Gnoblars - often used as additional drops I consider them very useful. Very cheap can simply protect the flanks well and interfere with the movement of the enemy. And they are truly expendable.

Ogres - small unit does not look like a threat but cannot be ignored, in particular if attacking from the flank. Fortunately, my heavy cavalry can outpace them and defeat them in one-on-one combats so I will look for the opportunities to do so!

Leadbelchers - very dangerous thanks to the fact they can move and fire and do not add penalties to shooting for doing so. They are big enough to make a difference in close combat too. Excellent regiment and I was lucky there was only one unit of these. But I would need to try and attack them as soon as possible. At the same time I would need to stay away from them. I might try some shooting but I will have some hard choices to make as they are not the only danger I would need to address quickly.

Sabertusks - great diverters, fast and strong enough to do war machine hunting on their own. I would need to hunt them down as quickly as possible.

Ironblaster - another priority. If unchecked it will keep hunting down my nobles and can potentially get flank shots as it can move and fire. Very useful. I would need to send eagle rider and heavy cavalry against it as it is too tough for reavers to even hope to hurt it.

Giants - wild card of the army. They are quite unpredictable but because of that they cannot be ignored either. They are relatively fragile but would need quite a large amount of firepower to be destroyed. I wanted to treat them as priority for shooters so that I could wound them and finish in combat before they would attack.

In general, Ogres are dangerous because they are fast, tough and hit hard in combat. Their stomps and impact hits add nicely to their combat potential and can devastate any unit of mine if charged. So I would need to make sure they don't and that I will be the attacking force. Ogres are fast but I have units that are still faster. As usual the way to defeat the enemy would be to divide and conquer. I also have shooting and magic that can hurt enemy units at the distance although I estimated I would have 2 turns only before Ogres attack.

Terrain

Image

In the last game I had a table with quite a good amount of terrain. Large hills in two corners, some forests to affect the shooting and possibly add more effects. Swamp that can be both, a benefit and liability. But I always like water on the battle field as it negates ranks and removes steadfast. It should be used to advantage for sure.

The small pillars in the top left were dangerous terrain that was important for potential movement of flanking forces. It was still hard to decide which side I would prefer to pick but I lost the roll-off and Tom chose North.

Deployment

Image
Deployment of the armies after vanguards

After vanguards I realized I made a mistake of moving Reavers on the right flank forward. I have no idea why I did it but it was foolish to put them in shooting range of Leadbelchers #-o

Slaughtermaster and BSB joined Ironguts. Butcher was with Leadbelchers. On the Elven side, BSB was with the left Archers while Loremaster joined right regiment.

Ogre wizards had the following spells:

Slaughtermaster - Spinemarrow, Bonecrusher, Toothcracker, Trollguts
Butcher - Iceshard, Comet
Firebelly - Fireball

Tom won the roll-off and Ogres begun:

Ogre Kingdoms - Turn 1

Image
Forward!

Image
Ogres advance

Ogres advance quickly towards the thin blue line. They use the opportunity given by the foolish young reavers and teach them the lesson leaving just one survivor to tell the tale. Ironblaster thunders from afar and single dragon prince dies.

Poor giant entered the forest only to learn that it was venomous wood and hurt his foot already.

Outcasts - Turn 1

Image
Attack on the left flank

Image
Shooting on the right

Elves had to act quickly so heavy cavalry attacked small unit of ogres to secure the flank. Big brutes decided to hold but were destroyed. On the right flank lone reaver leveled his spear and charged big cat prowling nearby but could not land the blow. Despite the momentum of the charge sabertusk didn't turn tail and started circling around the elven warrior.

The shooters aimed at either leadbelchers or giant as some of the archers could not target the same enemy yet due to lack of range. The giant was hurt and one leadbelcher was killed.

Ogre Kingdoms - Turn 2

Image
Moving forward at a double

Image
Almost there!

Ironguts and giants didn't slow down at all and kept running forward. One of them was hurt again by the treacherous forest! Ironblaster kept hunting Elven noble but this time his magical shield saved him.

Brave reaver wounded the sabertusk but stubborn cat refused to give up!

No battle counts for real if some regiment is not fleeing off the table! This time Swordmasters decided it is time to go home after a few casualties. Really, they could have waited for a better excuse #-o

Outcasts - Turn 2

Image
Apologies for the blurry picture

Image
Larry the Loremaster is on Fire!

Eagle rider flew to the very edge of the battle field, staying close to attack the Ironblaster but not too close to risk grapeshot. Dragon Princes marched fast too and risked jumping over the dangerous terrain that claimed one of their companions. Cavalry commander joined them quickly and all were getting ready to charge through the storm of fire.

Reavers on the left hunted down the sabertusk but the lone young warrior on the right flank finally left an opening and the big cat got him!

Then Larry the Loremaster entered the stage. First, he cast seemingly innocent magic missile made from pure light that Slaughtermaster ignored. TO his surprise that missile turned into an inferno that claimed one giant. He tried to stop fireball but Larry the Loremaster was on Fire and the attempt to dispel the spell failed. Another giant went down! (Edit: I tried to wound the giants before inevitable combat but I got some crazy rolls. d6S4 hits claimed no less but 4 wounds on one giant and that was enough to kill it as it was wounded already. Second giant got 2d6 S4 hit and that too was enough to kill it as both of them have lost 2 wounds each so far!)

The shooters were very impressed and tried to kill lone figure on the hill (I can't remember if it was Butcher or Firebelly) and the Ogre was left barely standing with single wound left!

Unfortunately, not all were so lucky. Lions charged Leadbelchers in an attempt to slow their advance but fear overwhelmed them and they managed to kill only one ogre while the attacks back claimed all of them. (Edit: As soon as I got these crazy rolls I was concerned as sometimes they are followed by the ones you don't like at all. Lions failed their Ld8 test with a re-roll. It meant they were hitting on 5's instead of 3's and were hit on 3's instead of 4's :()

Ogre Kingdoms - Turn 3

Image]
The momentum of the attack was stalled

Image
Ironguts kept moving forward

The momentum of the attack was definitely stalled but Ironguts pushed forward and trampled the eagle blocking their way. Leadblechers waited for their wounded comrade and moved towards the elven lines too. Ironblaster claimed cavalry commander who was no more tricks up his sleeve to save him.

Outcasts - Turn 3

Image
Disaster!

Image
Wrong type of fireworks!

Dragon Princes wanted to avenge their commander and charged the Ironblaster. They wounded it but the crew kept their rinox in check and they didn't flee. Eagle rider was supposed to join the fight but could not make it on time (Edit: I rolled 1,1,2 for charge distance).

The regiments maneuvered around Ironguts trying to isolate the Leadbelchers instead. Larry the Loremaster tried some ice magic this time but it seems that the tension it created between fire and ice resulted in a Dimensional Cascade despite his insurance policy in the form of the Earthing Rod. Detonation claimed him and at least half of the unit of archers! (Edit: As often I got double 6 on just two dice. When I rolled cascade I thought I am ok because I have my trusty item. But somehow I managed to re-roll 1,2 result into 1,1! To add insult to injury I didn't get that 4+ to save my general. At least the unit didn't panic!)

What a turn of events! #-o :lol:

Ogre Kingdoms - Turn 4

Image
Ogres charge!

Image
Things don't look good for the Elves

Ironguts finally have somebody to attack as foolish Archers held their ground, what a mistake! They were destroyed in no time and Ogres reformed to seek another target.

Dragon Princes avoided the attacks of the Ironblaster and even managed to wound it again but the enemy still kept on fighting!

Firebelly moved out of the unit and destroyed all but one of the archers with his fiery breath but elven BSB and regimental standard bearer didn't flee.

Outcasts - Turn 4

Image
Elves kept on fighting!

Image
Leadbelchers defeated

Eagle rider proved that he can be late to the party twice in a row and Dragon princes called for the aid from nearby Swordmasters instead. (Edit: This time I rolled 1,1,1 for the charge range! :lol: )

Another unit of the heavy cavalry attacked stubborn Leadbelchers (due to the spell cast previous turn) but despite that they didn't hold fast and were run down in pursuit! (Edit: Tom was considering fleeing as the distance was not that short but he decided to play for more fun and seeing that I am almost crying after the spectacular loss of the Loremaster he decided to hold and let me have some fun too! Thanks Tom!)

Bob the BSB also had some score to settle and swung his great weapon wide to deal the final blow to already wounded Firebelly.

Ogre Kingdoms - Turn 5

Image
Last attempt to kill some Elves

Image
The spell didn't work

Seeing no targets to attack Slaughter master moved out of the unit and tried to claim regimental standard with the power of magic but that failed him. Finally, Dragon Princes managed to break the Ironblaster all by themselves!

With the fast elves too far to attack and rest of the army gone, Slaughtermaster gave the order to march away. Besides, it was definitely past lunch time and the boys were hungry.

Summary

Image
Turn-by-turn summary animation

After-battle thoughts

Many thanks to Tom for a great game! =D> He was a fantastic opponent and I will be honored to play against him again. In particular, I wanted to thank for letting me charge his Leadbelchers when he didn't have to and I didn't realize until after the game I was sulking so badly after the loss of the Loremaster! Sorry for that, Tom! :oops:

The game ended in a draw! And it was full of unexpected dice rolls, that's for sure!

I was happy with the development of the game until that crazy magic phase turn 2. Don't get me wrong, I was very glad I got two giants in a single phase with some S4 magic missiles. But as I expected dice gods had some cruel plan for me! :-P

I also don't blame the dice, just wanted to show how they affected the game despite the odds. Tom was great at passing Ld test no matter what the modifiers were! Ironblaster, sabertuks, they both did very well. Unfortunately, that was balanced out by total inability to land a blow with the very Ironblaster against Dragon Princes. On the other hand, rolling 1,1,2 and then 1,1,1 for charge distance with a flying noble was just hilarious! :lol:

And then the most spectacular Cascade ever! I really think Larry the Loremaster wanted to celebrate Australia's Day so badly he started fireworks a little bit early :) I didn't mention that during the previous games but he actually cascaded 4 times during that tournament and 3 times Earthing Rod saved him. 4th time his magic item didn't help but what can you do?

I am happy with the outcome of the battle and I am just wondering if we forgot to play 6th turn or simply nothing happened and I forgot to take pictures? I do remember trying to shoot at the Slaughtermaster turn 5 but I did nothing and it was unlikely I would do any harm to him.

Anyway, there were a few things I should have done better:

1. Vanguard of the reavers was plain stupid and I don't know why I did that. #-o
2. I possibly moved Lions unnecessarily when they could have stayed behind the forest for extra protection. The charge looked reckless but I counted on killing 2 ogres and holding the Leadbelchers for some time. Maybe even win the combat and break them too! In the end I lost the unit for nothing.
3. I didn't position Dragon Princes well to intercept the giant early in the game, should have checked the angle better.
4. The same with the eagle against sabertusk, I left the place for it to move and I had to call reavers back to hunt it down.

I am looking forward to your feedback on what else could have been done different, on both sides!

That concludes my series of reports from CanCon 2015 and I will follow with a summary at some stage. Thanks for reading and sorry it took so long to write them all!

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Boss Salvage » Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:30 pm

Thanks for this latest batch of tournament reports Swordy, always a pleasure :mrgreen:
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Huntsmen » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:41 pm

Great set of reports Swordmaster! Was an absolute pleasure. The game against the Ogres you really couldn't of done a lot more, sure you made some minor mistakes/errors however you got pretty much all the points you could of got out of his list without tackling the Gutstar. Lady luck let you down and you lost too many points in the process as well as time which hampered your ability to deal with the Guts. But well played and a very interesting last game to a tournament.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Silas7 » Thu Mar 26, 2015 3:17 pm

Hooray for game 8! Congrats on a hard fought draw! Your dice were really all over the map: one round you're blowing up two giants, the next Larry is falling down a hole! There are a few small things you could have done differently which would have a big impact on the game.

If you shoot the sabertusk with the bolt thrower, that saves your Reaver and lets you use him later for a redirector. That would have been really handy to stop the ironguts from killing your archers later in the game. To be fair, no one expects the sabertusk to pass two Ld3 break tests, that's just madness!

The archers should have moved up closer to the white lions, so the BSB could do this thing. It could have negated the failed fear test and given you a re-roll if you still lost the combat. The archers would have been safe because you blocked the ironguts with your eagle. Well played!

The rest of the game went well (except for failed charges beyond your control) and you had a great fourth round. Good times! I hope you had a great time at the tournament. So, when's the next one? ;)
Chris O'Brien
ETC 2012 - Canada WFB
ETC 2013 - Canada WFB
ETC 2014 - USA WFB (coach)
ETC 2015 - USA WFB
Armies painted: 8 (Brettonians, Daemons of Chaos, Dark Elves, Empire, High Elves, Ogre Kingdoms, Skaven, Tomb Kings)
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Swordmaster » Fri Mar 27, 2015 10:19 am

Thanks for comments, guys! :)

@ Boss Salvage

Thanks! I am happy to know they were entertaining! I was worried that the fact I uploaded them at much slower rate would affect the whole experience but I hope it was not too bad!

@ Huntsmen

Thank you!

I was really happy with the outcome of the last game even if the fact that Larry misbehaved in the way his predecessor, not less notorious Archie, was not even close to! :D But such crazy rolls make a much better story! I just wish I had more time to write a proper narrative. Hence, I am even more glad to know the report was interesting to read!

I still hope to learn how to tackle Gutstar one day though :)

@ Silas

Yes, quite huge swings and Tom was commenting on that too! Btw, he and his buddy started a series of podcasts so you can listen to his experiences at CanCon here:

https://thehobbyforge.wordpress.com/201 ... last-year/

They have recorded quite a few hobby related podcasts since then so make sure to check them too!

I agree that I would have had a nice opportunity to kill sabertusk with a bolt thrower but at the same time I was facing a decision. To shoot it but do not focus fire on fast approaching ogres or attack with the reaver instead and try to break it on the charge. It was risky because the cat has t4 and 2w so even with a spear and re-rolls to hit I can't guarantee I will have even a single wound. On the other hand it has 2S4 attacks and there is a chance lone reaver would simply die. Looking at it with the benefit of hindsight I think I should have shot at it. Much better chance to eliminate it and then I would have free shooting for much longer. And as a bonus, reaver would have been very handy to distract Ironguts as you said.

I wish I knew why I make decisions like that sometimes :)

The funny thing with White Lions is that I equip them with Gleaming Pennant for such situations like this one against Leadbelchers. But I failed the fear check on a re-roll anyway and proximity of BSB would not have mattered! However, I should have moved Archers anyway so that Swordmasters would have the chance to re-roll their panic check. With my ability to fail them so often I really need to pay extra attention to where the units are, in particular these that are still close to the edge.

It was a great game and I was really lucky to have 8 fantastic opponents. Tom was great in the last game and I am really happy I met him and the others on the battle field. I can only hope they enjoyed the games at least as much as I did and I hope I will be able to get back to Oz in a few months so that I will have an opportunity to meet them again.

Well, I have one more game in a pipeline (played against pkng on UB) but it will have to wait a little. As to other tournaments, it will be more difficult but I will do my best to play some games anyway and come back with more reports!

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Swordmaster » Fri Mar 27, 2015 11:06 am

Hi guys,

Here is the short summary (as I am on the holiday trip now so I have limited time):

Summary

CanCon 2015 was another success and a great event with 120 players (and only because there was not enough space to host more!) The organization was flawless so many thanks to Tom and Mark who organized the event this year. Well done, guys and really good work! =D>

I like the variety of armies I saw on the tables, the scenarios played well and I find active Swedish comp a very interesting approach that results in playing against unique armies that are not so soft as their comp score may suggest. As always, it is all about the player, his imagination and creativity as well as skills with the army that result in a success.

I had fantastic time, win or lose, with 8 great players with whom I would play again in no time! I hope they enjoyed the reports (if they read them :)) and I am looking forward to the future events (fingers crossed that I will be able to attend them!).

The only criticism I have is about the terrain. It looks like the plan to secure it didn't work out. Long before the event the organizers asked willing participants to provide their own terrain to the pool. It looked like they had a list of people who added a lot of their own things and everything looked amazing. On the day, however, we saw these strange papers indicating dangerous terrain and forests. To me it looked like they encountered some last second problem and that was the only solution. I am really sorry it happened as I am sure it was not their fault. Hopefully, next year they will be able to avoid that problem.

I performed better than last year but was still not good enough to get even closer the the great success from 2013. I had 4 victories, 2 draws and 2 losses that gave me 87/160 points and resulted in 37th position. I was a little disappointed as I know I can do better but as always, the fact I made some crucial mistakes during my games was the reason I lost too many points in the process. My mood improved a little bit when I noticed that many players had the same amount of points (I don't know what was used as a tie breaker as the list looked like it was sorted simply alphabetically) and that I had 20th score. Ah well, the solution is simple, I need to play better and make fewer mistakes!

It was interesting to see the end result and the top 10 armies where:

1. Kairos Daemons
2. Thirster led Daemons
3. Leadbelcher Spam Ogres
4. Dark Elves
5. Empire
6. Daemons
7. Wood Elves
8. Daemons
9. Vampires
10. Lizards

If I recognized the names properly I think the best HE army was 17th. Below are the lists of some of the top armies:

1. Nick Legrand - Daemons of Chaos, 13.1 comp
Kairos 565
Herald of Slaanesh on Steed, Great Locus, Greater Gift 215
22 Plaguebearers, FC, Gleaming Pennant 321
22 Daemonettes, FC, Banner of Swiftness 287
5 Bloodcrushers, Standard, Razor Banner 380
6 Fiends 390
3 Screamers 120
3 Screamers 120
Total 2398

2. Chris Penwarden 2400pts, 16

Bloodthirster, 2x Lesser Gift, Greater Gift
Herald of Korne, BSB, Exalted Locus of Wrath, Blood Throne of Khorne
The Blue Scribes
27 Bloodletters of Korne, FC, Swiftness
27 Bloodletters of Korne, FC
5 Chaos Furies
5 Chaos Furies
5 Flesh Hounds of Khorne, Ambushers
3 Bloodcrushers of Khorne
Skull Cannon of Khorne

3. Simon Turner, 15.6
L3 Slaughtermaster(Heavens)(250) book of ashur(70)-320[23]
BSB Bruiser(130)IronFist(4) Banner of discipline(15)-154[18]
L1 Butcher(Maw)(100) Scroll of Shielding(15)-115[7]
Hunter(130) Harpoon Launcher(10)-140[4]
Hunter(130) Harpoon Launcher(10)-140[4]
3 Ironguts(129) Musician + Banner(20) Gleaming pendant(5)-154[4]
3 Ironguts(129) Musician + Banner(20)-149[4]
3 Ironguts(129) Musician + Banner(20)-149[4]
3 Ironguts(129) Musician + Banner(20)-149[4]
5 Leadbelchers(215) Musician(10)-225[8]
5 Leadbelchers(215) Musician(10)-225[8]
6 Leadbelchers(258) Musician(10)-268[23]
1 Sabertusk-21[3]
1 Sabertusk-21[3]
Ironblaster-170[27]

4. Lachie - Dark Elves 14.9

Dreadlord: Armour of Destiny, Obsidian Amulet, Other Tricksters Shard, SH, SDC, Lance, Black Dragon 553
Master: Battle Standard, Charmed Shield, Talisman of Preservation, HA, SDC, Halberd, Dark Pegasus 207
Master: Dragonbane Gem, HA, SH, SDC, Lance, Manticore, Iron Hard Skin 263
Sorceress: Lore of Heavens, Level 2 Upgrade, Scroll of Shielding 130
9 Dark Riders: Full Command, Shields, Crossbows 210
22 Corsairs: Full Command, Repeater Handbows, Banner of Swiftness 287
10 Darkshards: Musician, Standard 140
6 Cold One Knights: Full Command, Gleaming Pennant 215
War Hydra: Flaming Breath 180
Bolt Thrower 70
Bolt Thrower 70
5 Harpies 75


5. Mick Ferraro, 15
Lords Grand Master, Shield, Rung Fang, Other Tricksters Shard
Heros Captain of the Empire, Battle Standard Bearer, Barded Warhorse, Lance, Full Plate Charmed Shield, Obsidian Lodestone
Battle Wizard - Life, Level 2, Duplicate Lore, Dispel Scroll
Battle Wizard - Life, Level 2, Duplicate Lore, Scroll of Shielding, Ruby Ring of Ruin
Core 34 Halberdiers - Full Command Detachment: 6 Archers
28 Swordsmen - Full Command
11 Crossbowmen - Standard Bearer
Special 5 Demigryph Knights - Muso & Standard, Gleaning Pennant
Great Cannon
5 Pistoliers
10 Reiksguard Knights - Full Command, Standard of Discipline
Rare Celestial Hurricanum
Luminark of Hysh

6. Sam Morgan, 14
Kairos Fatewearver 565
Herald of Khorne, Exalted Locus of Wrath, Bloodthrone of Khorne 335
23 Bloodletters, Full Command, Banner of Swiftness 367
23 Bloodletters, Full Command, Gleaming Pennant 357
5 Bloodcrushers, Full Command, Razor Standard 400
3 Screamers 120
4 Plague Drones, Standard, Champion, Lichebone Pennant 255

7. Johannes - Wood Elves

Wood Elves Swedish 15.5

Spellweaver Lv3 Beast (general) 265 -19
Steed, Talisman of preservation, Scroll of shielding

Spellweaver Lv3 Metal 220 -19
Steed, Opal amulet

Glade Captain BSB 105 -13
Charmed Shield

Naestra & Arahan 495 -35
Ceithin-Har (Dragon)

18 X Glade Guard 300 -9
Lord's Bowman, Trueflight Arrows, Musician, Standard

18 X Glade Guard 300 -9
Lord's Bowman, Trueflight Arrows, Musician, Standard

7 X Wardancers 115 -3
Champion

6 X Sisters of the Thorn 166 -12
Musician

6 X Wild Riders 193 -9
Shields, Champion, Standard, Gleaming Pennant

6 X Wild Riders 188 -12
Shields, Champion, Standard

Eagle 50 -5

9. Nathan Goodchild, 15.5
Vampire Lord 25: Lore of Vamp; Charmed Shield; Talisman of Preservation; Ogre Blade; Potion of Foolhardiness; Quickblood; heavy armour; Zombie Dragon 596
Necromancer 17: Lore of Vamp; Dispel Scroll; Level 2 Wizard 125
Necromancer 10: Lore of Vamp; Scroll of Shielding; Ruby Ring of Ruin 105
Tomb Banshee 7: 95
5 Dire Wolves 2: Doom Wolf 50
5 Dire Wolves 2: Doom Wolf 50
5 Dire Wolves 2: Doom Wolf 50
30 Crypt Ghouls 9: Crypt Ghast 310
20 Zombies 3: musician; standard bearer 70
20 Zombies 3: musician; standard bearer 70
8 Hexwraiths 20 240
2 Fell Bats 5 32
2 Fell Bats 5 32
Varghulf 5 175
Varghulf 5 175
Terrorgheist 30 225
2,400 points

10. Ben Wadsworth, 15.3
old blood, cold one, great weapon, tali o'preservation, glittering scales, potion of foolhardiness
slann , focus of mystery, ironcurse icon
scar vet, cold one, bsb, armour of destiny, great weapon
scar vet, cold one, dawnstone, dragon helm, light armour, great weapon
skink priest, heavens, dispell scroll
23 saurus, fc, hand weapon & shields 283
20 skink cohort, fc, javs 130
20 skink cohort, fc, javs 130
16 skink cohort, fc, javs 110
13 skink skirmishers, javs 91
23 tguard, fc, ap banner, shields 397
8 camo skinks, blowpipes 104
basiladon, solar engine 150

I will probably try to look at the list with more details at some stage but as always, the list was ok, it had potential to win more and it simply required to be played better. :)
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Game 8 - 25.03

Postby Boss Salvage » Fri Mar 27, 2015 7:07 pm

Swordmaster wrote:It was interesting to see the end result and the top 10 armies where:

1. Kairos Daemons
2. Thirster led Daemons
3. Leadbelcher Spam Ogres
4. Dark Elves
5. Empire
6. Daemons
7. Wood Elves
8. Daemons
9. Vampires
10. Lizards

Interesting to see so many daemons in the top ... even if Kairos features in half or more of them #-o

I say this as I head into Crossroads tomorrow, which is using ETC and considered pretty crippling to competitive DoC builds - hence there being only three daemon players total. Luckily for me my Daemons of Tzeentch receive a 'cuddles & snuggles' rating no matter the comp :8)
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Summary

Postby Squigkikka » Mon Mar 30, 2015 5:33 pm

What a journey! And what a ridiculous amount of games, I do like it- although I'd be personally be exhausted day 3, it does help eliminate lucky streaks (or bad ones) and generally even out the matchups. I realize I've not commented on the Beastman game, so I'll do that first!

Beastmen: You managed to get away with relatively few losses against Slugtongue, lucky! That could've been a gamechanger.

That Lv4 dying was definitely a big deal for him, since he's spent so many points into buffing his magic phase with that Herdstone. That's how fickle magic is though, and you can't really complain about it since it's a part of the game.

I have no idea why he didn't push early though? His chariots are standing still, and so is the rest of his army. Did he think they would take DTs for moving into the forest, do you know? Perhaps he forgot that Chariots don't march, and thus simply moving into the forest will not trigger DTs. He's not really exerting a whole lot of pressure, or scaring off your WL/SM units by holding back the way he does.

The screening unit of Gors I don't agree with either, it makes it incredibly for his fat unit to actually charge and threaten stuff. You showed him just how annoying it can be with that charge, was a great move!

I think his movement was a bit sloppy and not very well thought out, and I suspect that the Lv4 death made him go on full tilt.

With that said, I think your maneuvering this game was brilliant! You did so much stuff right, it was great to see! In particular, I really liked the DP charge on the Gors (sufficient to win combats, but not enough to complete wipe them or make them run). The flank on his Gors was beautiful too, and my favorite bit was the double feigned flight of the Ellyrian Reavers. That's textbook fast cav right there, Swordmaster! :D Good stuff!

Why didn't you have time for the full game? His movement phases can't have been too cumbersome, wouldn't have expected Beastmen to drag on. Did you ever think it was foul play, or maybe inexperience?


Ogre Kingdoms: Yeah, I think you're pretty triggerhappy with the Reavers even when there's no benefit in diverting/vanguarding. It's definitely a fun thing to do though, so I can't blame you, haha. Still, having those Reavers intact really could've saved the day later on.

I'm surprised he deployed his left Ogres so... exposed, I guess? They definitely look like an easy meal for your Dragon Princes.

Those Dragon Prince reforms after eating the Ogres are unfortunate, but I see the sense in not giving the Ironblaster a full flankshot off on them. It's a pity you had to go back to hunt Sabretusks though, your diverters are sorely needed in delaying that character bus!

Pity the Loremaster goes down too, but that's karma, eh? Lv4 in the Beastman game went down the drain, this game it's your turn. It's as you say- those wounds on the Giants spelled the doom of something else, no doubt! :D

I think you played the game alright, thankfully those Giants are there to help pick up points in what otherwise might turn out to be very staunch points denial. A 10-10 ain't bad against Ogre Kingdoms for your MSU I'd say, considering impact hits and stomps and high M to intercept your units.


Overall: I think you can be happy with your games, Swordmaster! You made some mistakes here and there, had your share of good and bad dice. It's really cool to see HE MSU because I think it really fits with their fluff and elite style. It's demanding to play and very, very, punishing if you screw the movement up. Hopefully the losses wont get you down, and instead see it as a learning process- meta inevitably changes, and while adapting is nice, I'd like to see your MSU well and intact.

Cheers for writing and making gifs and images and all that stuff man! Yours are the only battle reports I bother to follow pretty much because they're not a clutter, the images are clear and I get a great overview over what's actually going on.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Summary

Postby Swordmaster » Tue Mar 31, 2015 4:29 am

Hi guys,

Thanks a lot for your comments!

@ Boss Salvage

I am not surprised to see such choices taken. First of all, for a long time special characters were not allowed at tournaments so naturally people want to try them out. It is also the chance to get an advantage over the opponents who might not be prepared to face them or simply don't have enough experience in fighting such armies.

How did Crossroads go for you?

@ Squigkikka

Thanks! I am glad you were entertained!

I cannot say why my opponent was passive but if I were to guess I think he simply built his army around magic phase and when that didn't work he was without plan B. His army has a good combat potential but he didn't use it. I also think he would have been better with deeper formations not hordes. That limits the amount of units I can charge with, keeps him steadfast for longer and allows better maneuvering in the narrow pass.

As you said I could block his flank with single unit and still maintain some pressure while holding up Bestigors with fast cavalry. I am also very happy with reavers performance and for me it is one of the best examples how this unit contributes to the way army can perform. And no other unit in the army list can do the same.

The game didn't feel like it was too slow when we played it. We had some situations where we had to look up the rules that always slows down things. There were a few harder decisions to make that made the game a little slower too. For example, the fact I parked these reavers in front of his unit required some more careful planning and we discussed some other options that were revealed once the move was resolved.

It is of course a pity because 20min more might have been all we needed to get the full 6 turns. But that is the reason why I am happy I pushed for early combats too.

As to the game against OK I didn't have that much experience against them so a draw is a good result. Now I have to work from that level to get better result next time!

I definitely want to continue with HE MSU and I am not giving them up. I of course hoped for better results because I did better before but I guess I just need to keep playing better games on regular basis and not make silly mistakes. Sounds obvious but that is the main reason why I lost my games.

As to the future reports I have one in pipeline (although you will need to wait for this one a little) and I will try to play more games no matter what. I will of course need to re-thin a few elements based on the recent experience too. I will not be able to play until mod April for sure though and with new edition behind the corner it is also a big question mark what this game will really become.

Cheers!
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Summary

Postby Boss Salvage » Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:39 pm

Swordmaster wrote:How did Crossroads go for you?
Five fun games with good guys, but fairly brutal match-ups for my blue daemons. I faced:

1. Empire (Light Council w/ Walter) - 1/19
2. Vampires (Quad-Vamp Knightbus w/ 120+ Zombies) - 16/4
3. Empire (Light + Heavens) - 8/12
4. High Elves (Alarielle in BotW Lionstar) - 3/17
5. Daemons of Nurgle (DP!) - 10/10

So two hard counters (1&4), two tough matches (3&5), one manageable one (2). As you can see from the results, I did as poorly as one might expect given the matches. Still a good weekend and I got to throw a lot of dice around ... but I have never felt so gimped by my pairings before. I guess that's a DoC in GT thing? I've played several single day events with the army but never a full GT, and never under ETC.

Here's hoping the next event I go to sucks it up and goes Swedish ;)

For the curious, there ended up being five DoC players at the event, out of 74-ish total. We collectively ended up:

39. Undivided w/ LoC
59. Khorne w/ Triple Thirsters + Double Grinders
61. Undivided w/ Triple Disc Heralds
62. Tzeentch (Me!)
64. Nurgle w/ DP + Skullcannon

Glad the Khorne guy did ok-ish, it was a crazy list with three of the new $100+ BT rampaging around :shock:
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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Summary

Postby Swordmaster » Wed Apr 01, 2015 12:32 pm

Thanks for info on the games! I am sure it was tough to get good results anyway as I heard Crossroads GT is simply tough tournament with a lot of very good players attending. It is interesting, however, to see that usually strong DoC armies had a difficult time. I am not that much familiar with ETC players pack, did Daemons got hit so hard by the composition? Also, 3 Blood Thirsters sounds scary anyway! It is intriguing to know who did they play against as from my personal point of view I would find fighting against them very difficult.

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Re: MSU HE at CanCon 2015 - Summary

Postby Swordmaster » Thu May 28, 2015 4:55 pm

Greetings!

By the end of February I had a great pleasure to play against Ulthuan own pkng! We tried to organize that game for quite a long time and finally it happened. Pkng wanted to test his ETC style army so we played on ETC maps too. I want to apologize for taking it so long to post the report but I had a lot to do in March before going for one month holidays and when I got back there was immediately a lot to do again. Hopefully I will have some hobby time now, especially that I have some plans for painting and gaming (check my army blog for details).

Pkng is not only a very good player (he is going to be part of the ETC team this year again) but I was about to have a chance to play against some special characters and the army I haven't had a chance to play so far. At a time of playing I was still writing reports from CanCon and as such I was not sure where I want to go with army list changes. Because of that I decided to go with the very same army anyway and see what I can do.

Here is the army Pkng selected for our game:

High Elves - Army List

Alarielle the Radiant, Star of Avelorn, Stave of Avelorn, The Shieldstone of Isha - 350
Tyrion, Dragon Armour of Aenarion, Heart of Avalorn, Sunfang - 410
Mage, level 1, Dispel Scroll - 110 - Lore of Light
Mage, level 1, Channeling Staff - 100 - Lore of Light
Noble, Battle Standard Bearer, Dragon Armour, Ithilmar Barded Elven Steed, Lance, Enchanted Shield, Luckstone, Ogre Blade - 178

15 Archers , Full Command - 180
5 Ellyrian Reavers, bows - 85
5 Ellyrian Reavers, bows - 85
10 Silver Helms, Shields, Full Command - 260

8 Dragon Princes of Caledor, Musician, Standard Bearer - 252
20 White Lions of Chrace, Full Command, Banner of World Dragon - 340
Great Eagle

My army list for the reference:

Outcasts - Army List

Loremaster, Obsidian Amulet, Armor of Fortune, Earthing Rod - 320

BSB, Dragon Armor, Great Weapon, Talisman of Preservation – 154
Noble, Great Eagle, Dragon Armor, Star Lance, Potion of Foolhardiness, Enchanted Shield, Golden Crown of Atrazar – 184
Noble, Barded Steed, Heavy Armor, Lance, Lion Cloak, Potion of Strength, Dawnstone, Charmed Shield – 149

14 Archers, Full Command – 170
14 Archers, Full Command – 170
6 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Herald, Bows, Spears – 136
6 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Herald, Bows, Spears – 136

5 Dragon Princes, Musician, Standard, Banner of Eternal Flame – 175
5 Dragon Princes, Musician – 155
10 Swordmasters, Musician, Bladelord – 150
10 Swordmasters, Musician, Bladelord – 150
10 White Lions, Musician, Guardian, Gleaming Pennant – 165

Eagle Claw – 70
Eagle Claw – 70
Great Eagle – 50

So another episode of civil war, quite fitting for the End Times era, even if the match up had nothing to do with the story line :)

The army pkng chose is quite compact (at least for me as you can easily have even fewer units) and character heavy. That is always a warning sign as it means some nasty tricks. I must admit that it really felt like playing against completely new army with Tyrion and Allariele in particular. Let me have a look at pkng's choices from the point of view of my own army.

Allariele - She can pick her spells from Life, Light and High Magic but the fact pkng had also two level 1's with lore of light meant to me he would probably go for Light with her as well for that nice high S Banishment. She gives magical attacks to her unit but against my army it does not affect anybody. Chaos Bane special rule also does not affect my troops. 5+ ward save against non-magical attacks is very nice and combined with Banner of the World Dragon (as I assumed she will be with Lions unless something bad happens) means it will be much harder to hurt her and her unit. Healing characters at the end of the turn is very, very helpful. Ability to cast the same spell twice in the same turn (even if only once per game) is very useful too.

In general, she is a powerful wizard that will be backed up by 2 acolytes and well protected among Lions. She will also add useful protective/healing abilities. In order to get to her I would need to go through entire unit first.

Tyrion - Probably the best Elven warrior :) He strikes at S7 with Flaming Attacks so it looks like it can be exploited by some characters or units with 2++ ward save against such. He also have a breath weapon style attack that may come handy. 1+ armor with 4++ ward and 2++ against flaming as well as 4 wounds and nearby Allariele to heal him means he is very well protected. Add to that MR(2) and he is even harder to get as well as adding some extra protection to any unit he would join. For example, Dragon Princes would get 4++ ward thanks to his presence against magic. He is very fast with M10 too so the way to deal with him would be to tie him in combat with a unit or a character that has 2++ against flaming attacks and try to break with combat resolution or at least to keep him pinned down.

2 x level 1 Mage - Light acolytes are here to help with channeling in order to provide enough power dice to cast spells comfortably (also with Channeling Staff) and Dispel Scroll is always good to have. As I have mentioned before I assume they are also here to help with high strength Banishment.

BSB - mounted BSB with reasonable protection and trusty Ogre Blade. Always good to have 3 ASF S6 attacks to add to any combat, in particular in the subsequent rounds. He may fight in the shadow of Tyrion but will be important for the army nonetheless.

Archers - good support units, full command helps it to fight other light troops. Potential place to hide for the characters if Lions are in trouble.

Silver Helms - option for Tyrion and BSB to join, adding some versatility to the army. Big enough to be a threat on their own too, especially for my elites against which they get re-rolls to hit. With S5 on the charge they have an advantage in such combat. On the other hand they will be vulnerable to counter attacks and my own cavalry, especially with nobles. Searing Doom is also a very good spell against them and a few magic missiles can dent their armor too.

Reavers - fast cavalry, with bows only. As always a priority for me to attack so that I have fewer enemy units that can interfere with my movement phase.

Dragon Princes - hitting harder than Helms and better protected, in particular with Tyrion. But if pinned down can be destroyed due to typical for my army swarming. In both cases (i.e. heavy cavalry) bolt throwers will be a main threat for them.

White Lions - very well protected against magic, good protection against shooting with pelts and Allariele. Any detonations due to miscasts will be saved thanks to the Banner. So thinning them down will not be easy. However, if I can isolate them and attack them with Swordmasters and Archers (yes, they can do harm especially when supported by magic) I can grind them down.

Eagle - a handy redirector, has to be eliminated quickly but I have tools for the job.

In general, pkng has a huge advantage in magic and I had a feeling he would try to use it as his main weapon with Lions as a mobile fortress and cavalry led by Tyrion and BSB as protectors and interceptors. My goal would be to use my own ranged attacks to kill reavers, eagle and maybe hurt heavy cavalry. Then divide and isolate his regiments in order to surround them and defeat them in combat.

Terrain

Image
Map 4 - Andorran Opening

In ETC format there are particular rules concerning terrain. I am going to copy-paste them from the relevant document:

Hills - As per BRB description of an ordinary hill (p. 118 first 5 paragraphs, i.e. without the“Examples of hills” subsection) with following additional explanations :
- Line of Sight: Hills block Line of Sight.

Forests - As per BRB description of an ordinary forest (p. 119 first6 paragraphs, i.e. without “Mysterious Forests” subsection) with following additional explanations:
- Line of Sight: Forests are Interfering terrain providing Soft Cover for units, as described in BRB. For Line of Sight purposes Forests count as being of infinite height. This implies that units shooting trough forest will always suffer Soft Cover penalty, even if shooting from a hill or building.

Lake - As per BRB description of a Normal River (p. 120 first 5 paragraphs, i.e. without “Mysterious Rivers” subsection) with following additional explanations:
- Line of Sight: Lakes are non-interfering terrain features.
- Lakes are Water Features.

Obstacle: Wall - As per BRB description of an ordinary Wall (p. 123 with common rules for Obstacles,p.122) with following additional explanations:
- Walls definition of a unit “behind” is applied only to units actually defending the obstacle (i.e.aligned with it and touching it).
- Line of Sight: Obstacles are non-interfering terrain features.

Ruins - As per BRB description of an ordinary marshland (p.121 first 3 paragraphs, i.e. without “Examples of Marshland”
subsection) with following additional explanations:
- Ruins are NOT Water Features.
- Line of Sight: Ruins are non-interfering terrain features, providing Hard Cover for all units withmajority of their models in the feature.

Impassable
As the title says - infinite height, impassable terrain.

During our game only Obstacles: Walls were not present. PkNg won the roll off to pick the side and he decided to deploy South.

Deployment

Image
Deployment of the armies

Image
After Vanguard

Pkng won the roll off to choose the side and picked South. Deployment order was as follows:

1. Ellyrian Reavers - Ellyrian Reavers
2. Ellyrian Reavers - Eagle
3. Eagle - Ellyrian Reavers
4. Swordmasters - Archers
5. Archers - White Lions
6. Archers - Dragon Princes
7. Swordmasters - Silver Helms
8. Dragon Princes - Characters
9. Rest of the army

Wizards picked the following spells:

Allariele - Burning Gaze, Pha's Protection,Net of Amyntok, Banishment
Mage - Burning Gaze
Mage - Burning Gaze

Pkng won the roll-of for the first turn.

Edit: Since we played on UB I have more details about the game, even down to particular rolls of dice so whenever it is possible I will add them. I know not everyone is interested in these so the details are always after the narrative and I tried to make it descriptive enough to make it clear what happened. Feel free to scroll down to see how the game developed without being slowed down by numbers :)

At the same time I hope the details I provided would help to see what decisions were made, what spells were cast and which units were shooting at each other as well as how combats were resolved. I think these details can be as interesting to some as the game in general.


High Elves - Turn 1

Image
Clenching the fist

Tyrion gave the order to advance and positioned himself at a tip of a spearhead formed from White Lions. The rest of the formation fell behind to guard the flanks and only Silver Helms moved forward somewhat alone. The barrage of magic begun. As a result entire unit of Dragon princes was banished from the existence but the noble bravely held his ground. Archers on the right flank were protected by the spell too.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 5,5 --> 10:5 (no channels)
Pha's Protection at Archers: 9,3 --> cast, no attempt to dispel
Banishment at Dragon Princes (DP1): 2,4,6,6 --> Irresistible Force --> 9 hits, 8 wounds, 3 saved after 5+ armor and 6++ ward saves, unit wiped out.
Miscast result - 1,6 --> all wounds saved by the Banner of World Dragon

Shooting phase details

Archers at Bolt Thrower - move, long distance --> 5+ to hit, 1 hit, 0 wounds

Outcasts - Turn 1

Image
Shy advance

Outcasts moved on the West to try and envelope the enemy. The rest of the army assumed positions for ranged attacks and unleashed all they've got on Silver Helms. However, their armor deflected all the incoming missiles, magical or mundane and only one single bolt went through the ranks unhorsing two knights.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,5 --> 8:6 (one channel each)
Burning Gaze at SH: 2,6 --> cast, no dispel attempt --> 5 hits, 4 wounds, all saved
2d6 Fireball at SH: 1,4,5 + 2 = 12 --> dispelled on 1,3,5 = 4 = 13
d6 Searing doom at SH: 2,5,6 + 2 = 15 --> dispelled on 4,5,6 + 4 = 19

Shooting phase details

Ellyrian Reavers at ER2 - move, long distance, forest --> 6+ to hit, 1 hit, 1 wound, not saved
Bolt Throwers at SH - short distance --> 3+ to hit, 1 hit, 2 wounds, no armor save
All Archers at SH - move, long distance --> 5+ to hit, 12 hits, 8 wounds, all saved

High Elves - Turn 2

Image
First attacks!

Dragon Princes charge enemy fast cavalry but both units perform feigned flight maneuver. In order to cover the flank, Reavers move in between heavy cavalries. On the East, Silver Helms charge bolt thrower and overrun into Swordmasters behind them!

Tyrion slows down the advance to wait for the resolution of the flank attacks and to give time for Allariele and acolytes to thin down the enemy further. Two enemy archers were burned down to the ground. Then Loremaster managed to dispel Banishment cast at Swordmasters (S2) and luckily for them, the second attempt with the use of Staff of Avelorn failed. Then the Archers shot at Bolt Thrower again and this time one crew member was dead.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,6 --> 9:6 (one channel attempt for Pkng)
Burning gaze at Archers: 1,5 + 4 = 10 --> cast, no dispel attempt --> 6 hits, 3 wounds, 1 save due to MR(2), 2 dead
Banishment at Swordmasters (SM2) : 2,2,3,3 + 4 = 14 (boosted version for extra range) --> cast, dispelled on 1,1,3,6,6
Banishment at Swordmasters (SM2) : 1,2,5 + 4 = 12 (re-cast from Staff of Avelorn failed)

Shooting phase details

Archers at Bolt Thrower - long distance, 5+ to hit --> 10 hits, 1 wound
Ellyrian Reavers at ER2 - 3 short distance, 1 long, move, 5+ and 6+ to hit respectively --> 1 hit, 1 wound, failed save, 1 dead

Outcasts - Turn 2

Image
Hitting back!

Fast cavalry rallied and together with the knights that accompany them, they continued harassing the flank. They shot down 2 of the enemy raiders but the survivors didn't panic.

On the East Loremaster, Eagle Rider and Archers rushed to help Swordmasters who were about to receive a hard punch. In the ferocious fight half of the regiment of warriors of Hoeth fell but they hit back hard and only 2 enemy knights were left standing. Surprisingly, they held their ground!

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 3,4 --> 7:6 (2 channels for Pkng)
Miasma at SH to lower WS: 1,3,4 + 2 = 10 --> dispelled on 1,3,4 + 4 = 12
Blizzard at SH: 1,2,5,6 +2 = 16 --> dispel scroll

Shooting phase details

Reavers at ER 2 - move, long range, 5+ to hit --> 4 hits, 3 wounds, 1 saved, 2 dead, panic test passed
Bolt Thrower at DP - long distance, flank shot, 4+ to hit --> missed on 3
Archers at Archers - long distance, 4+ --> 7 hits, 6 wounds, panic test passed

Combat phase details

Eagle Rider vs SH Champion - challenge, SH Champion in the top left corner - Eagle Rider hits once on 3+ and wounds with no armor save allowed, SH Champion strikes at the same time - no hits.
SH at Loremaster - 1 attack on 4+, misses
SH at Swordmasters - 4+ with re-roll - 6 attacks, 5 hits, 5 wounds (2+), no save, 5 dead
Archers at SH - 4+ to hit, 10 Attacks (due to challenge blocking some of them), 5 hits, 3 wounds, all saved on 2+
Loremaster at SH - Great Weapon, 3 attacks, 3+ to hit, 1 hit, 1 wound (2+), saved on 6 (needed 5+)
Swordmaster at SH - 11 Attacks, 3+ to hit, 9 hits, 6 wounds (2+), 1 saved (needed 4+), 5 dead
Steeds at Swordmasters - 2 attacks, 4+ to hit, 1 hit, 1 wound (4+), saved on 6 (needed 5+)
Combat resolution: 11:7 in Outcasts favor --> Break test passed on a roll 1,2

High Elves - Turn 3

Image
Western flank is secured

Dragon Princes spotted the enemy knights trying to go around the flank and charged them. They retreated but in doing so were moved in the sight of Ellyrian Reavers and withdrawal turned into a retreat but heavy cavalry could not outrun fast horse and were destroyed in pursuit. (Edit: There is a slight mistake in a diagram but Dragon Princes could see my DP2 and that was my big mistake not to make sure they moved out of sight in the previous turn.)

Dragon Princes changed the direction of the attack and once again chased enemy fast cavalry but the Western flank was now controlled.

Silver Helms could not hold against more numerous foes now and brave knights were cut down to pieces. But magic was strong and Outcasts suffered some more casualties.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,6 --> 8:6 (no successful channels)
Burning Gaze at Swordmasters (SM2): 2,6 + 4 = 12 --> no dispel attempt, 4 hits, 3 wounds, no saves, 3 dead, panic test passed.
Net of Amyntok at Archers (A1): 1,3,3 + 4 = 11 --> dispelled on the roll 1,2,3,5 + 2 = 13
Banishment at Bolt Thrower: 4,4,5 + 4 = 17 --> failed dispel on the roll 1,5 (needed double 6 anyway) --> 7 hits, 2 wounds, dead bolt thrower, panic tests for destroyed unit passed

Shooting phase details

Archers at Archers - long range, 4+ to hit --> 4 hits, 4 wounds, panic tests passed
Reavers (ER1) at Reavers (ER1) - short range, move, 4+ to hit --> 5 hits, 3 wounds, 2 saved, 1 dead

Outcasts - Turn 3

Image
Premature attack

Reckless nobles decided it is a good time to attack. They wanted to use their opportunity to pin down and isolate the main enemy unit while the rest of the foe army was occupied elsewhere. Nearby troops were to advance at a double to be ready to create a second wave of an attack. However, they underestimated the defensive abilities of the unit protected by magic. Many of their attacks were deflected either by armor, everqueen's magic or banner's protection. Tyrion then stepped in and unleashed the fiery breath of his magical sword that incinerated enemy Archers. Outcasts lost combat by a smallest of margins but it was enough to break! They lost their regimental and army banner in retreat and eagle rider fled too! Tyrion and Lions chased him knowing that a single Archer and a Noble are not going to rally anyway. What a disaster for the Outcasts!

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,6 --> 8:7 (1 channel for Pkng)
Burning Gaze at the eagle: 1,4 + 2 = 7 --> dispelled on 3,6 + 4 = 13
d6 Fireball at the eagle: 2,4 + 2 = 8 --> 2,5 + 4 = 11
Miasma to lower WS at Lions: 3,4 + 2 = 9 --> dispelled on 3,4 + 4 = 11
Blizzard at Lions: 2,6 + 2 = 10 --> dispel attempt fails on 1 + 4 = 5

Shooting phase details

Ellyrian Reavers at the eagle - move, short distance, 4+ to hit --> 2 hits, 1 wound
Archers at the eagle - move, long distance, 5+ to hit --> 3 hits, 1 wound

Combat phase details

BSB vs Mage - challenge issued by BSB, Mage accepts - Mage fails to wound - BSB with GW wounds twice - Mage saves both with 5+ ward save
Archers at lions - 8 attacks, 4+ to hit with re-rolls, 2 attacks at champ, 2 hits, 2 wounds, no save, dead champ --> 6 at regular lions, 6 hits, 5 wounds, 3 armor saves on 5+, 1 ward save on 5+, 1 dead lion
Eagle Rider at the Lions - could hit the Queen but chose Lions so he can have re-rolls - 3+ to hit, 2 hits, 2 wounds, both warded on 2+ thanks to the Banner
Mounted noble at Tyrion - 4+ to hit, misses all attacks
Allariele at eagle rider - 5+ to hit, hits, does not wound
Mage at archers - 5+ to hit, misses
Tyrion breath weapon at archers - 2d6: 3,4 --> 7 hits, 4 wounds
Tyrion at mounted noble - 4 attacks, 4+ to hit, 2 hits, one deflected by charmed shield, 1 wound, saved on 6+
Malhandir at archers - 2 attacks, 5+ to hit, 2 hits, 2 wounds (3+ to wound)
Lions at Eagle Rider - 3 attacks, 5+ to hit, 1 hit, 1 wound, saved by golden crown
Lions at Archers - 5 attacks, 4+ to hit, 2 hits, 2 wounds
Eagle at Lions - 2 attacks, 4+ to hit, 2 misses, 1 stomp, failed save and ward, 1 dead lion
Combat resolution - 8:9 in pkng's favor, break test Archers at -1, need 8 on re-roll, got: 4,6 and 3,6 --> flee, lose bsb and regimental banner --> eagle rider break test at -1, need 8 but no re-roll due to dead bsb, got: 3,6 --> flee --> 1 archer and noble flee to safety, Tyrion and Lions chase Eagle Rider but don't catch it.

Edit: That was quite a long and complex combat considering there were only 2 units engaged :)

High Elves - Turn 4

Image
Tyrion finishes the job

Tyrion charges alone from the unit to catch fleeing Eagle Rider and catches him. Lions reform to continue magical attacks. The rest of the army reforms and converges towards the center. Outcasts are at huge disadvantage.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 4,5 --> 10:5 (one channel for pkng)
Burning Gaze at Swordmasters (SM1): 2,6 + 4 = 12 --> no dispel attempt, 6 hits, 1 at champion, fails to wound, 4 wounds on the rest, 2 saves, passed panic test
Burning Gaze at Swordmasters (SM1): 3,6 + 1 = 10 --> no dispel attempt, 2 hits, 1 wound, 1 dead
Burning Gaze at Swordmasters (SM1): 6,6 = IF --> 1 hit, 1 wound, 1 dead
Miscast Result: 3,3 --> all wounds saved by the Banner, 6 dice lost, end of magic phase

Shooting phase details

Reavers at Reavers (ER1) - short distance, move, 4+ to hit, 4 hits, 3 wounds, 1 saved, panic test passed
Archers at Reavers (ER1) - long distance, move, 5+ to hit, 4 hits, no wounds

Outcasts - Turn 4

Image
Fighting withdraw

At this stage it was clear that the day was lost and it was all about trying to save what could be saved. Hence the regiments moved backwards and reavers tried to hunt down the wounded eagle while Loremaster and Archers tried to elimnate support troops.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 1,3 --> 4:3 (no channels)
Burning Gaze at Reavers (ER1): 1,2 + 2 = 5 --> failed dispel on a roll of 2 --> 5 hits, 1 wound, no save
d6 Fireball at Reavers (ER1): 5,6 + 2 = 13 --> failed dispel on a roll of 2,6 +1 = 9 --> 4 hits, 3 wounds, no save

Shooting phase details

Reavers at Reavers (ER1) - move, short distance, 4+ to hit - 4 hits, 2 wounds, dead unit
Archers at Reavers (ER2) - move, long distance, 5+ to hit - 4 hits, 1 wound, 1 save

High Elves - Turn 5

Image
Closing in to finish off the enemy

Outcasts were defeated but not broken yet. So Tyrion spurred his steed and raced forward to catch the enemy one more time. Lions advanced too while Dragon princes moved to form new battle line. Allariele targeted remaining Swordmasters but they survived and held their ground.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 1,6 --> 7:6 (no channels)
Burning Gaze at Swordmasters (SM2): 3,3 + 4 = 10 --> no dispel attempt, 3 hits, 2 wounds, no saves, panic test passed
Banishment at Swordmasters (SM2): 1,2,2,5,6 + 4 = 20 --> failed dispel on a roll of 2,2,2,2,3,5 + 2 = 18 --> 4 hits, 2 wounds, no saves

Shooting phase details

Reavers at Reavers (ER1) - move, short distance, 4+ to hit --> 2 hits, 1 wound, no save, panic test passed
Archers at Reavers (ER1) - move, short distance, 4+ to hit --> 2 hits, 2 wounds, 2 saves (double 6!)

Outcasts - Turn 5

Image
Pulling back

Outcasts continued their withdrawal and kept using whatever resources they had to hunt down enemy support units. Unfortunately, Reavers failed to finish their counterparts while Archers did a good job against enemy bowmen. They didn't panic though and remained on the hill.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,3 --> 5:4 (1 channel for Pkng)
Spirit Leach on BSB: 2,2,2,3,5 + 2 = 16 --> dispelled on a roll of 1,4,4,4 + 4 = 17

Shooting phase details

Archers at Archers - long distance, 4+ to hit --> 8 hits, 5 wounds, panic test passed

High Elves - Turn 6

Image
Mopping up

With Outcasts too far to attack directly it was up to Tyrion to charge alone and he did so against the Archers, cut down brave champion and surprisingly, his companions broke but were fast enough to flee to safety. Allariele used her magic to finish off the surviving Swordmasters though.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 2,6 --> 9:7 (one channel each)
Burning Gaze on a lone Swordmaster: 1,2,5 + 1 = 9 --> no dispel attempt, 3 hits, 2 wounds, no save, dead
Banishment on Swordmasters (SM2): 2,2,2,5 + 4 = 15 --> dispelled on a roll of 3,4,5,6,6
Burning Gaze on Swordmasters (SM2): 1,6 + 4 = 11 --> failed dispel on a roll of 1,4 + 2 = 7 --> 1 hit, 1 wound, no save, 1 dead, failed panic test on 5,5 and fled from the table

Shooting phase details

Reavers at Reavers (ER1) - move, short range, 4+ to hit --> 1 hit, 1 wound, saved on 5
Archers at Reavers (ER1) - 3+ to hit --> 3 hits, 2 wounds, 1 saved, failed panic test on 4,5 and fled from the table

Combat phase details

Tyrion vs Archers - challenge, 4 attacks, 3+ to hit, 3 hits, 3 wounds, no wounds back, lost combat, steadfast, failed break test on 4,5 but escaped the pursuit.

Outcasts - Turn 6

Image
All is lost

Outcasts lost the day and it was their last attempt to hit back to (slightly) decrease the margin of the defeat. However, the winds of magic were very weak and the fireball attempt was dispelled. Only Reavers could shoot this time and they tried to get their counter parts but failed.

It was a heavy defeat for the Outcasts.

Magic phase details

Winds of Magic: 1,2 --> 3:3 (1 channel for Pkng)
2d6 Fireball at Archers: 3,4,6 + 2 = 15 --> dispelled on a roll of 4,5,5 + 4 = 18

Shooting phase details

Reavers vs Reavers - move, 4+ to hit --> 1 hit, no wounds

Summary

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Turn-by-turn summary animation

After-battle thoughts

First of all I would like to thank Pkng for a great game and congratulate him for a well deserved victory! =D> I was really impressed by the way he used his fewer units to keep the tight but mobile formation. In particular, his use of characters is something I admire as it kept his options free and made his army very versatile. I would also like to add that it was very inspiring to see how he first advanced cautiously but eliminated main threats (such as bolt throwers) then secured his Western flank and followed up with a final push to collect many points in the last turn.

Unfortunately, I am not happy with my own performance and I made several mistakes that cost me a lot. Against a very good player like Pkng they are even more costly because he exploited them immediately. That turned an interesting game into a fight for survival and minimizing the losses. Because we played with ETC format I lost 1:19 as the VP difference was 1300+. By comparison, if that result was achieved at last CanCon it would have been "only" 4:16.

Let's have a look at the things that I believe contributed to the end result:

1. Deployment - it is always something to analyze. Even if the battle went your way. In this case, I know that I didn't use my assets well from the start. First, I exposed Dragon Princes and they could have been a target. I should have at least put them further away to force boosted version of Banishment.

I also exposed Bolt Throwers, although if I wanted to place them elsewhere, then I would probably have to re-arrange whole battle line.

I didn't use the Eagle Rider in particular, to create a danger zone and Silver Helms could approach close enough to threaten bolt thrower but be safe from my Star Lance.

2. Western Flank - I had more units in there to try and at least threaten the flank but due to the mistake with Dragon Princes positioning, I lost the unit and the flank. That allowed pkng to move forward aggressively later during the game.

3. Premature Charge - Despite the fact that I discussed options with pkng during the game (more what can be done if did A and what if I did B but still) I didn't do the right thing. First of all, I didn't take into account the possibility of mages accepting the challenge. My intention was to tie Tyrion in combat with a noble or BSB so I thought that with a frontal attack he cannot decline the challenge.

In addition, he could still use his breath attack against the unit of archers and that was what was needed to shift the balance. Another mistake. On top of that I completely forgot about the Banner and Star Lance attacks went for nothing.

It was not the end of the mistakes I made in that combat. I should have rolled break test for Eagle Rider first, when I still had BSB. That would gave me the chance to charge the unit with Swordmastes, Lions and possible another unit of Archers as a second wave I planned.

However, the main question is: was it a good idea to charge so early? I could have blocked WL with an eagle and position regiments even better for a combined charge with many more regiments instead. I lost 2 heroes, bsb and a unit of archers due to that reckless charge. It is 782 points from single failed combat! #-o

4. Lack of focused ranged attacks - I think I also made a mistake in terms of focusing my ranged attacks. For example, having a flank shot against Dragon Princes was tempting and I fell for it but even if I hit and killed entire rank of the knights they would not flee (not likely with BSB among them) but instead I allowed some reavers for survive when I could have got rid of them. I also left 4 archers alive that should have been eliminated earlier. These are minor things in comparison to blunder of my premature attack but would have given me points I didn't get.

I wish I could have put up a better fight and I am afraid this time pkng was not tested to the fullest of his potential. Hopefully we will be able to schedule a rematch at some stage and that I didn't miss the lessons!

I also hope you have found this report entertaining!

Thanks for reading!
Blog: Path of an Outcast

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Rabidnid wrote:Are you seriously asking someone called Swordmaster of Hoeth why he has more swordmasters than white lions? Really?

Swordmaster
Posts: 1170
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Location: White Tower

Re: MSU HE - 2400 vs HE - 28.05.2015

Postby Swordmaster » Tue Jun 09, 2015 6:43 pm

Greetings!

On 4th/5th July there is a tournament called Gronkcon, here is the link to the relevant topic at wargamerau:

Gronkcon 2015

It is an unique tournament and the organizers encourage interesting army lists but also you score points by fulfilling scenario objectives and achievements only. If you are interested in details about the scenarios, here is the players pack:

Gronkcon - Player's Pack

and the list of achievements (although it may still be subject to changes):

Gronkcon - Achievement's List

Unfortunately, I will not be able to attend that tournament but a very good friend of mine and Ulthuan.net own Darth Sabre, is going to be there. Since we tried to schedule another game between us it was a good idea to allow me to have a taste of Gronckon experience and provide some practice for Darth who decided to field Empire army this time. He even wrote a piece of background so with further ado here is the story and the army list!

Darth's Empire - Background

The sun will slowly set on the 8th Age, some say the golden
age, and the dawn of the 9th Age will arrive. At the end, the
Last Battle will be fought on the slopes of Shayal Gronk and
there will be merriment, shenanigans and questionable
behaviour. A champion will emerge to lead those that remain
into an enlightened new glorious era.


Prophesies of the Gronk
Author Unknown
(Believed to be a drunken shell of a man sprawled
over a Macca's bench after a night out with the
Gronks)


Darth Franz gazed down the escarpment, open plains stretched before him with tall grass rippling in the wind, forests and thickets to both the east and west. In the distance he could see the slopes of Shayol Gronk, his destination. He had been strangely drawn to his place, a sense of longing, a sense of destiny had overtaken him these last few months. He had battled his way across the old world, fought army upon army from the Forces of Destruction, witnessed the death of many friends and heard rumours of the death of so many hero’s and champions of the Old World. But here he would seek his revenge. He turned and looked over his shoulder at the pitiful remnants of his once mighty army, the End Times (“erk the End Times Bro”) had been brutal. The once mighty Empire, guardians of the Old World, was almost destroyed, shattered, broken and scattered across the lands.

But where there was life there was hope and he would fight to his last breath, the revenge he sought was close, so close he could almost taste it. At his side stood Von Thrillhelm, his trusted bodyguard. “At last we arrive my friend, what do you think awaits us?”

“Who knows bro, it surely can’t be any worse than what we have faced these last few months” replied Von Thrillhelm.

“I am not so sure, there seems so many new foul creatures walking these lands recently, its truly seems the end approaches.” A violent gust of wind almost knocks him from his feet. Darth screams aloud, “F*** Goldmember how many times have I told you not to land that flying fleeball so close to me”. Silently to himself he murmur’s “and why would any Lord of the Empire ride a flying horse when there are Griffons to ride…”.

Goldmember ignored him, he long ago gave up caring what others thought. “Chill out Darth dude… I have scouted the lands to the west of Shayol Gronk … It doesn’t look good bro … lots of nasty poop out there man, daemons, vampires, chaos everywhere, jees man I even saw beastman…. who would have thought beastman would roam these lands again ... you may be leading us to our death bro.”

Before he could reply a band of soldiers lead by curious looking little man appeared from the forest to the left of him. Marius Maximus and his Huntsman had returned from their scouting trip of the eastern forests surrounding Shayol Gronk.

“What do you have to report Marius” asked Darth.

“My lord, my lord I have lots to report, so much to report, oh my lord it is splendid, so splendid. So many monsters we saw, so so so many - there is much sport to be had.” Marius squawked. God help me thought Darth, he couldn’t quite remember the last monster Marius and his little band had actually killed. He was beginning to think the legendary monster killer was a myth but he would see.

“Yes Marius, lots of monsters – wonderful for you – but have you found us a safe path to Shayol Gronk – that was your mission.” Darth asked wearily.

“oh yes my lord, oh yes my lord, Marius has found a path. To the east lies many elven encampments, it appears they have landed on the beaches and made their way inland. The whole of Ulthuan seems to be camped down there to be honest my Lord… not that they
have anywhere else to go … ha ha ha ha ha… we can go that way and approach Shayol Gronk from the east.” Marius replied.

Goldmember added “So it seems the forces of destruction from the west and forces of good from the east with the last battle to happen around Shayol Gronk… as the legend prophesises – time for me to make more gold – ha ha ha ha ha”. He promptly mounted his Pegasus and flew away.

Darth turns to Von Thrillhelm. “Looks like our path has been found, once more into the breach my friend. Our pitiful band looks outmatched here, a psychopathic wizard with a penchant for turning things to gold, a mad monster hunter who doesn’t seem to be able to hit the side of a barn from 10 metres and a small band of weary soldiers.”

Von Thrillhelm continues to stare at Shayol Gronk and mutters “What are you going to do bro, what are you going to do….”


Darth's Empire - Army List

Darth Franz (Unascended - F*** End Times Bro): Deathclaw 555
The Reikland Runefang; The Silver Seal; full plate armour,
Infantry (Special Character); Hold the Line!; Immune to Psychology; Leader of Men
Deathclaw : Monster; Bloodroar; Fly; Large Target; Loyal Beast; Terror
(AKA: Karl Franz, the Emperor)

Kakwah Goldmember, The Supreme Physco: Imperial Pegasus 375
Level 4 Wizard; Lore of Metal; hand weapon; Amulet of Sea Gold; Cloak of Molten Metal; Staff of Volans
Monstrous Cavalry (Special Character); Loremaster (Lore of Metal)
Imperial Pegasus: Iron-harf Hooves; Swift as the Wind Monstrous Beast; Fly
(AKA: Balthazar Gelt, the Supreme Patriarch)

Mad Marius Maximus Meridius. Gronksmarshall of the Empire 140
The Amber Bow; hand weapon
Infantry (Special Character); Hatred (Monsters); Immune to Psychology; Monster Hunter; Scouts;
Wulfhart's Hunters
(AKA: Markus Wulfhart, Huntsmarshal of the Empire)

Ludwig Von Thrillhelm, The Emperors Colossus: Barded Warehorse 185
Sword of Justice; full plate armour; The Emperor's Standard
Cavalry (Special Character); The Emperor's Bodyguard; The Emperor's Herald
(AKA: Ludwig Schwartzhelm, the Emperor's Champion)

The Emperor’s Guard: 9 Inner Circle Knights: FCG; Steel Standard; lances, shields, full plate armour; barding 290
The Wolf’s Guard: 10 Empire Knights: FCG; great weapons full plate armour, barding;
The Golden Shield: 15 Halberdiers: halberds; light armour shields; mus; std 125

The Emperor’s Hammer: 5 Demigryph Knights: FCG; Banner of Swiftness; lances; full plate armour; barding; shields 335
Monstrous Cavalry; Fear; Armour Piercing
Max’s Huntsman: 15 Wulfhart's Hunters: FCG; hand weapons; bows; 195
Infantry; Immune to Psychology; Monster Hunters; Scouts; Skirmishers

The Fire of Heaven: Celestial Hurricanum 130
The Emperor’s Dragons: Helblaster Volley Gun 120

Army Total: 2700

I would like to add that Kakwah, Maximus and Thrillhelm are all tournament organizers of the event :)

There are many special characters in this list so I took some time to check what their special abilities are, hopefully finding a weakness to exploit.

Karl Franz - The leader of men, his special abilities make him really good at inspiring the troops. Ld 10 and 18" range or even 24" if mounted on Griffon or Dragon! He is also Immune to Psychology so he will definitely lead by example. But he should not be ignored as a threat in combat either. This time he has his Runefang that wounds automatically and allows no armor save. That is a powerful weapon even considering average for a lord level Weapon Skill. In addition, his loyal Dethclaw can punch too. Blood Roar is already a problem as it forces the enemy to take terror test on 3d6 and you discard the lowest result. Some troops may flee before the combat even starts! Deathclaw has 5 S6 attacks at WS6 so together they can do a lot of damage, especially adding some t-stomps. Karl Franz is also sporting MR(2) and 4++ so casting spells at him may not be the best idea.

In this case shooting should be the solution. Even archers can score some wounds against the griffon and wounded beast can be finished before it has a chance to strike back. Of course it is easier said than done because I am sure he would seek any cover before striking terror into the hearts of Elven warriors.

Balthazar Gelt - Supreme patriarch is a Loremaster so no need to roll for spells. Metal magic can be a powerful weapon but my heavy cavalry is well protected against it. On the other hand, Golden Hounds may be an issue for Larry as his protections goes "only" to 3++ instead of 2++ against flaming attacks. I know Final Transmutation is quite a popular spell and it may affect my troops too. With additional bonus of +2 to cast spells Baltazar can be quite efficient.

He is very well protected against normal shooting with 3++ ward save. However, magic can be dangerous as his MR deepens on how many wizards are present in the enemy force. In this game he will have only MR(1) and I will seek an opportunity to provide some warm welcome in the form of a well placed fireball :)

Marcus Wulfheart and Huntsmen - he is a hunter and likes to hunts monsters. Not good news for Bob and his new pet Griffon. His Amber Bow always wounds monsters on 4+ and inflicts d3 wounds. In addition, he can bring his own company of Huntsmen who can always shoot at a monster and ignore the rider. Re-rolling "to hit" rolls when shooting at it too! At least they have S3 bows only. As they are scouts I would need to make sure to hide my BSB well so that they cannot target him turn 1. An interesting thing is that Marcus and his hunters are Immune to Psychology and as such cannot flee. That may be a problem for the scouts and I will look for a chance to exploit that too.

Ludwig Schwartzhelm - BSB of the army. He is a great help for the Emperor in terms of leading the army and holding it together. With Ld10 from Karl Franz in 24" and his 18" area of influence combined with small and compact army it is almost impossible to fail panic checks. Not to mention some units are ItP anyway. So I had to assume I need to kill every member of a unit to claim the points. He is also quite good in combat with his Killing Blow special rule and re-roll to wound rolls that missed. I would not risk Larry to meet him but Bob might actually give it a try since his Griffon has ASF and the same initiative as Ludwig.

Inner Circle Knights - First among heavy armored regiments of the Imperial army. 1+ save is always a challenge for my army despite the fact I do have some tools with it. I simply had many games where 3+ or 4+ armor saves were enough to deflect my attacks and ruin the combats for my infantry. The Knights are also stronger and faster thanks to the standard, no penalty for barding here! Of course well placed flank shot with bolt throwers or searing doom can do the trick here. And once pinned in combat S4 might still not be enough to prevail, of course if isolated and fighting alone.

White Wolves - not a popular choice but I think it has the uses and there might be some bonuses for taking it for this particular event. They are more consistent in damage they can deal and with 2+ armor they are still well protected. If they can cooperate with IC Knights they will be very dangerous too.

Halberdiers - with no infantry characters in the army and small numbers they are probably going to perform garrison duties. However, well timed flank charge may be very dangerous so I should keep an eye on them just in case.

Demigryph Knights - the most powerful unit of the army, 5 of them make it even more dangerous as they can take some damage and still be powerful enough to kill any unit I have on their own. Priority target for bolt throwers (and single shots only) and searing doom. I can take them down in combat only isolated and only when attacked from the flank, unless there are 3 or less to start with (so that I can kill 1, maybe 2 if lucky and with overwhelming force).

Hurricanum - it is here to provide extra power dice for Baltazar but also to help the units in combat. Hitting on 3+ with usually high strength is what they need. At least there are no priests to grant hatred too. It is also a chariot and can be used as a great support or even a charging unit on its own against some of the smaller regiments of mine. Fortunately, it is a little bit slower than the rest of the army so there is a chance it may stay behind too far. In any case, a dangerous unit but not a priority to be destroyed.

Volley Gun - another dangerous element in the enemy army. I decided that I will wait with the Archers to see where it is deployed and will try to shoot it down as it may ruin my plans for potential multiple charges. The opportunity may also arise when the steel wall of knights moves forward and there is not much left behind to defend it.

It is clear that to give myself a chance in that game I would need to slow down and separate the enemy units so that I can deal damage by shooting and magic and prepare the charges on isolated targets. It is by no means easy as the enemy is fast and can be ready to charge turn 2 with not many places to hide.

Outcasts - Army List

Larry the Loremaster, Earthing Rod, Armor of Fortune, Obsidian Amulet - 320
Bob the Battle Standard Bearer, Griffon (Swiftsense, Swooping Strike), Dragon Armor, Lance, Talisman of Preservation, Enchanted Shield - 356

15 Archers, Full Command - 180
15 Archers, Full Command - 180
5 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Bows, Spears - 105
5 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Bows, Spears - 105
5 Ellyrian Reavers, Musician, Bows, Spears - 105

5 Dragon Princes, Musician, Banner of Eternal Flame - 175
5 Dragon Princes, Musician - 155
10 Swordmasters, Bladelord, Musician - 150
10 Swordmasters, Bladelord, Musician - 150
10 Lions, Banner, Musician - 150
10 Lions, Banner, Musician - 150

2 x Bolt Thrower - 140
2 Great Eagles - 100
2 x 5 Sisters - 140

Army Total: 2691

Terrain

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Terrain details:

Hills - block line of sight
Building - 2 levels, blocks line of sight
Rocks - impassable, block line of sight
Lake - as river, mysterious terrain
Forrests - mysterious terrain
Wall - hard cover

Deployment

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Deployment order

Deployment order:

1. Halberdiers (H2) - Ellyrian Reavers (ER1)
2. White Wolves (W) - Ellyrian Reavers (ER2)
3. Inner Circle (ICK) - Ellyrian Reavers (ER3)
4. Hurricanum (H1) - Great Eagle (GE1)
5. Demigryphs (DK) - Great Eagle (GE2)
6. Hellblaster (VG) - Eagle Claws (EC1 + EC2)
7. Characters - Rest of the Army
8. Huntsmen

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Deployment after Vanguards and Scouts

Empire won the roll off and had the first turn.

Empire - Turn 1

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Imperial steam roller moves forward

Darth Franz gave the order and his knights moved forward as one. Halberdiers were left behind to protect Volley Gun while the crew was disappointed none of the cowardly Elves moved in the range of their Hellblaster. Far on the Eastern flank Maximus led his Huntsmen towards the hill as he sensed a monster lurking behind. They had to be careful as enemy heavy cavalry could catch them in the open.

Kakwah Goldmember landed his pegasus nearby the forest and decided to make fine dragon princes' armor look less splendid with some rust but it seems he miscalculated and didn't draw enough power to cast a spell.

Magic Phase Details

Winds of Magic: 3, 5 --> 10:5 (Hurricanum + 1 channel for Empire)
Plague of Rust at Dragon Princes (DP2) boosted version: 1, 2 --> failed to cast, end of magic phase

Outcasts - Turn 1

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Outflanking maneuver

Elves moved swiftly performing wide outflanking maneuver with the use of cover provided by the centrally positioned farm houses. Dragon Princes on the East threatened the Huntsmen and one of the Fast cavalry squadrons assisted them.

The regiments on the West shifted a little, either assuming better positions for shooting or withdrawing to avoid unnecessary attacks of imperial knights.

Then Larry the Loremaster attacked his adversary with all the magical fury he could muster. Small Light spell was cast as a distraction and then huge fireball flew across the battlefield. Much of its power dissipated over the distance but enough was left to catch Kakwah unaware and imperial wizard was burned to ashes in an instant.

The Elven warriors followed the example of their general and aimed their bows carefully. Archers failed to inflict any casualties against the crew of a Volleygun but two White Wolf knights were unhorsed by flaming arrows of Sisters of Avelorn. Eagle Claw crews aimed well too. Two huge bolts sailed through the air and both impaled Demigryphs each, one even penetrating to the second rank. Imperial troops were visibly impressed by this show of a firepower.

Magic Phase Details

Winds of Magic: 3, 4 --> 8:5 (one successful channel each)
Shem's Burning Gaze at Baltazar: 1, 1, 5 + 2 = 9 --> cast, dispelled on 4, 4 + 4 = 12
3d6 Fireball at Baltazar: 1, 3, 4, 4, 6 + 2 = 20 --> cast, dispel attempt failed 2, 3, 5 + 4 = 14 --> 5 hits --> 3 wounds --> no successful ward saves on 6++

Shooting Phase Details

Archers and Revaers (A1, A2, ER1) at Volleygun - 13 hits total, no 6's to wound
Sisters at White Wolves - long distance, 3+ to hit, 3+ to wound --> 5 hits, 5 wounds --> 3 saves, 2 dead
Eagle Claws at Demighryps - long distance, 4+ to hit, 2+ to wound (single bolts) --> 2 hits, both wounded --> 1 multiplied to 3 wounds, 1 to 1 wound --> 1 dead knight, 1 wounded

Empire - Turn 2

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Tactical retreats

Demigryph knights didn't want to wait for yet another salvo and charged Sisters of Avelorn who wisely retreated. The knights changed the direction of the attack but Archers also didn't want to risk being crushed by the beasts. Their withdrawal turned into a more chaotic maneuver than intended and they had to flee the battle to regroup.

Fast cavalry in the center of the battle field didn't manage to bait White Wolf Knights and instead were shot at by the Volley Gun. Miraculously two of them survived but their steeds were terrified to run away no matter what.

Finally, Maximus and his Hunters tried to surprise another squadron of the fast cavalry but Elves didn't leave anything to chance. Maximus shouted to attack nearby heavy horse but his companions got confused and now they were sitting ducks in the open. It seems hunters were about to being hunted themselves.

Shooting Phase Details:

Volley Gun at Reavers - 4, 6, MISSFIRE - number of shots halved = 5 --> 4+ to hit --> 4 hits, 3 wounds --> failed panic check on a roll of 3, 6

Outcasts - Turn 2

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Another heavy blow

Elves continued their maneuver but this time they also attacked. Dragon princes on the East used the opportunity and charged Maximus and his Huntsmen. There were no survivors.

Larry the Loremaster summoned all his power and channeled it into a single powerful spell that killed two demigryphs outright and wounded another. It was not without the cost, however, as powerful feedback temporarily erased the magical formulas from Larry's mind. There would be no magic in this battle anymore.

Eagle Claw crews followed and suddenly out of the proud unit of the best imperial knights only a single warrior was left standing.

Magic Phase Details: 1, 4 --> 6:4 (1 successful channel for HE)

Searing Doom at Demigryphs (boosted version): 1, 3, 5, 5, 6, 6 --> cast as IF --> 11 hits --> 7 wounds
Miscast Result: 4, 6 --> lost 3 magic levels --> no more abilities to cast spells

Shooting Phase Details:

Archers at Volleygun - 4+ to hit (long distance) --> 7 hits, 1 wound
Eagle Claw EC2 at Demigryphs - 4+ to hit --> hits, wounds, multiplies to 3 wounds, dead demigryph

Empire - Turn 3

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Empire tries to strike back

Imperial troops were in shock but tried to press forward. Inner Circle Knights attacked the annoying eagle while last demigryph charged reavers who took one for the team in order to draw the enemy into a trap. Darth landed nearby ready to charge soon and avenge his knights. But Elves let him?

Outcasts - Turn 3

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Counter-strike!

Dragon Princes spearheaded the attack but to their surprise White Wolf Knights simply fled through entire battle line. Could it be they learned that tactical maneuver from somebody?

Bob the BSB and Larry the Loremaster with his bodyguards of Swordmasters attacked lone Demigryph who took the charge bravely but soon joined his companions in the afterlife.

Then all the shooters aimed at Darth Franz. Archers didn't manage to penetrate his armor or wound his griffon. Sisters aimed carefully too and they sneaked in a single arrow into Emperors body. Then dreaded eagle claws aimed at them. Yet again two single bolts sailed through the air and yet again both hit home. One wounded Darth and when his magical protection failed he fell dead from the saddle to the ground. Another tore a deep gash in the griffon side. The beast roared in pain, took the limp body of his master and flew away.

Seeing this Thrillhelm, as the only remaining officer in the army, signaled the retreat to save the life or remaining soldiers of the Empire.

Summary

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Turn-by-turn summary animation

After-battle thoughts

It was unlucky game for Darth and seeing no possibility to turn the tide he conceded after losing his general. Technically he had 2 powerful units to fight with but they were not in position to attack anything of value. I didn't expect that my shooting would be so efficient and that I would be able to inflict such damage so quickly. I know Darth was not happy with such outcome as it was difficult to have fun when bolt throwers kept hitting all the time and got maximum would multiplication almost every time.

I wanted to finish this report only because we advertised the game at Ulthuan.net and there were forum members waiting for it.

I also wanted to thank Darth for providing list and story line. I am sure he will have much better luck at the even itself. Many thanks to those who showed up in the peanut gallery to watch it!

Feel free to comment on any aspect of the game!

Thanks for reading!
Blog: Path of an Outcast

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